The rationale in this video is excellent.
One can safely take it to the bank.
But there is another variable not mentioned. That of the actual discussion as to the right of Israel to exist as a state.
To quote a good friend of mine, and of this site,
“If you do not support the right of Israel to exist, you may as well turn on the ovens yourself”.
It is with sorrow that I have come to agree with this statement. No other nation seems to be under discussion as to its right to merely exist, even though a lot of countries were minted at pretty much the same time and under similar conditions. In fact Pakistan was created more recently than Israel and under conditions that more closely resemble the ones that Israel is accused of, rather than actually the ones under which it was forged.
Pakistan was created because Muslims would not agree to be part of a pluralistic state when the British decided to let India become an independent entity free of British colonial rule. They wanted the new nation to be Islamic and under the sharia. When that idea was rejected, well the rest is a rhyme of what Muslims always do when not allowed to rule over everyone else. Create a new Islamic State then branch outwards.
The right of Israel to exist is a separate matter, or rather should be, from criticism of its policies and history. But I have never heard from the popular left any discussion about any other nation’s right to exist.
So in this kinds of discussions I find myself having with locals on occasion they generally go like this.
Generic lefty: “The problem with criticism of Israel is if you say anything bad about the country, you get labelled an antisemite!”
Me: Thats because in every case I have encountered, critics of Israel are using antisemetic arguments, even if they themselves do not think of themselves as antisemites.
No one who calls Israel an apartheid state ever mentions the fact that there are two cities in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia that wont even allow non Muslims in.
No one who talks about the Israeli security wall ever mentions any other border wall from the great wall of China to the Egyptian walls to protect themselves from the exact same people.
No one who talks about Israeli policies ever mentions other nation’s identical policies as problematic, or even fact checks if Israel even has those policies under criticism.
No one who talks about the Jewish lobby ever seems to think the Muslim lobby, which is backed by Saudi oil money and the UN’s OIC and its fifty odd nation states influence might also affect how Canadian and US policies might get set. And its pretty obvious these days exactly which lobby is winning out there.”
That usually ends the discussion. Not because I won it. But because they decide that I am proof of their assertion, that anyone who criticizes Israel gets labeled an antisemite.
I agree, I have never heard anyone who is against Israel that doesn’t end up outing themselves as Jew Haters.
What Richard said !
“No other nation seems to be under discussion as to its right to merely exist, ”
no dispute about Palestine’s right to exist then ?
odd then isn’t it that Danny Danon Israel’s UN ambassador disputes Palestine’s right to exist, Naftali Bennett denies Palestine’s right to exist,
in fact only 4 of Israel’s ministers supports a two state solution http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.727431
and you can bet that the state they don’t accept isn’t Israel
The people in Gaza and parts of Samaria and Judea have been offered statehood a few times. They rejected it as they are playing for the conquest of Israel. No one is denyig them a state but them.
Should they decide to accept the terms any other state has to live under, they would get statehood in about an hour. Its hard to grant statehood when your constitution (Hamas charter) includes a commitment to genocide of the Jews and destruction of Israel.
So the comparison is rather specious.
offers ? such as the oo-so-generous Barak offer or Bibi’s demand that Palestine accept a demilitarised shred of land
your consitution ? Hamas isn’t all Palestinians .. compare that to the range of senior Israeli politicians who want to wipe Israel off the map
The comparison is accurate except for the reaction of the international community who insist the Palestinians recognise Israel but turn a blind eye to our ally Israel
I don’t, you don’t, no one needs an opinion on the matter, not when we have an expert to rely on.
Our expert here is on matters regarding the legitimacy of the “Palestinian” mission and “national” ambition is Zuheir Mohsen, former PLO leader. In a 1977 interview for a Dutch publication called Trouw, Zuheir Mohsen said the following:
“The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism.
For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.”
Keep in mind that the previous name of this land was “Israel” until the Romans renamed it in the 2nd century to what eventually became “Palestine.” So-called “Palestinians” are laying claim (1964 CE) to a land the Romans named as an insult to the Jews they were expelling (135 CE).
Are you sensing the scale of the preposterous yet?
@barney rubble it’s a valid argument that Jordan is palestine, try reading up on the subject, I tend to agree, but the majority in israel, tend to allow palestinians to also have the majority of judea and samaria as well as Jordan, Gaza every one agrees they are welcome to.
Are you seeeeeriously thinking that getting your misinformation from HAARETZ gives you an alibi?
I think I have seen other videos with him in them.
The issue is, that Israel knows it is in an ideological war, the West does not.
Uppermost in Islam’s jihad is to wipe all Jews off the planet.
“Q. 5:60 Say (O Muhammad to the people of the Scripture): “Shall I inform you of something worse than that, regarding the recompense from Allah: those (Jews) who incurred the Curse of Allah and His Wrath, those of whom (some) He transformed into monkeys and swines, those who worshipped Taghut (false deities); such are worse in rank (on the Day of Resurrection in the Hellfire), and far more astray from the Right Path.””
So sanity dictates to keep all the strategic land captured in war and demilitarize Palestine.
Hence a sovereign state is not possible until it becomes civilized and secular too. (See Iraq after America deposed a man who knew everything about the Muslim Mind).
I just wish we could find some Zoroastrians who wanted an ancient homeland to free them from persecution too, to become Israel’s most excellent neighbors.
That by a knock-on effect, the world once again remembered how to live for the individual’s right and our totalitarian regimes fell.
From the link: “To conquer Persia and force Islam, the Arab invaders resorted to many inhumane actions including massacre, mass enslavement of men, women and children, and imposition of heavy taxes (Jezyeh=Jizya) on those who did not convert. By the order of “Yazid ibn-e Mohalleb” in Gorgan so many Persians were beheaded that their blood mixed with water would energize the millstone to produce as much as one day meal for him, as he had vowed. The event of blood mill has been quoted by the generations of Iranian Zoroastrian families to this day, yet our books of history have been silent about it.”
Socialism and Islam; they have so much in common to talk about.
Christianity is a movie none of us were in. Same goes for Judaism and for that abortion Part 3: Return of the Jihadi.
Britain drew many lines on the globe. Israel was its best.
When is anti-Israel actually antisemitic? (see my personal answer at the end of this post)
One of the reasons I love Vladtepes is that – unlike about 90 % of the blogo-twitter-facebook-sphere – it is not infected by Jew Hatred and hence seems to attract decent and intelligent people. (kisses all ’round to you Vladers and Vladettes)!
As that recent survey found: One in three Jew-Haters is just as stupid as the other two. I think that stupidity is one of the most dangerous human traits in and against humanity. And make no mistake the “I dont hate Jews just Israel” figleaf has become totally see-through for folk who have not sprung from the Arabian (*) Petri dish of centuries of inbreeding or the dumbed-down herd who still thinks that being of the Left is “chic”.
BUT, I have one problem with Israel and the Jewish People (other than some of their leftist and Kapo mutations) which is: DONT BE SO DAMN TOLERANT OF THE BOTTOM BARREL OF HUMANITY ! You will get no brownie points for being good and always tending the other cheek you will run out of cheeks!
Jew Hatred (I refuse to call it “Antisemitism” which attracts the arabs-are-also-semites-crap) is a virus which only goes dormant from time to time, but with the breeding frenzy among morons these days, the periods of its hibernation will become shorter and shorter. HIT BACK while you can, the goodies are on your side !
Have a look at the first video in this post – although I address “Europe” my message holds for Canada and the US !
A L W A Y S !!!
(*) Yes Virginia, Paaalesteeeeenians are Arabs !
Rita I don’t tell you this anywhere often enough but thank you for all of your hard work, I know that I am speaking for many others on the blog when I say this. May your road be smooth and your life long and productive. May you never have any troubles and as the Irish say may you be in heaven before the devil hears you are dead.
What Richard said-
~ ditto ~
@ Richard & yucki 🙂 ta muchly, even though I feel a little like a freeloader with these compliments. Road still a little on the bumpy side at the moment – so just popping in….will be back more efficiently soon. Keep the “homefires” burning !
Even equating Israel’s supposed “apartheid” policies, even putting them somewhere in the same league as a nation like Saudi Arabia, is Jew-hatred in itself.