Imam charged with sexual battery on teen boy at Tampa mosque

Just in case anyone thinks this rape case is an isolated exception and not actual Islamic policy by Imams to create terrorists you may want to read this Phyllis Chesler piece on the making of a terrorist. Also, previous articles on Vlad where an Iraqi woman was captured who recruited women, sent them to rape camps where they then became suicide bombers in Iraq.

Oh yeah and how rape of males is used to create terrorists:

tampa-mosqueBy JOSH POLTILOVE | The Tampa Tribune

Published: May 18, 2009

Updated: 01:09 pm

Yasser Mohamed Shahade

TAMPA – A 35-year-old imam sexually battered a 13-year-old boy at a Tampa mosque Sunday morning, police say.

The victim was staying overnight at the mosque at 1307 W. North B St. waiting for early morning prayer, an arrest report states.

Yasser Mohamed Shahade, a prayer leader who had been in the country for about two months and had been staying at the mosque, sexually battered the victim about 6 a.m., police say. Police were called about noon Sunday, and they responded to Tampa General Hospital, where the call came from, police spokeswoman Andrea Davis said. Police aren’t releasing the name or details about the person who made the call, and details about the boy’s condition aren’t immediately available.

After responding to the hospital, Davis said, police went to the mosque. Shahade was arrested about 5:30 p.m. Shahade remains in Orient Road Jail. His bail has not been set.

A jail sergeant said Shahade declined to comment today.

The 2,400-square-foot mosque, Masjid Omar Al Mukhtar, opened within the past year. It has a worship area upstairs that can hold 50 women and an open room below where the mosque’s 130 male members worship.

Details were unavailable about who else had stayed overnight at the mosque, Davis said.

Former mosque board member Yusuf Strohmier said he was surprised after being told by a reporter of the arrest.

“If he did it — which is a key there, because you have to have witnesses — that’s just sick,” he said. “That is a sick thing to do.”

Gary Dicus, who owns a building next to the mosque, also was shocked by the charge against Shahade.

“It’s disturbing as the dickens,” he said.

Alaa Attia, a trustee of the mosque, said that if the accusation is true, it would go against the teachings of Islam.

Ramzy Kilic, executive director of the Tampa Council on American Islamic Relations, agreed. If true, he said, “The full justice of the law should be brought to this person.”

Stay with TBO.com for updates.

Reporter Jamie Pilarczyk and researcher Stephanie Pincus contributed to this report. Reporter Josh Poltilove can be reached at (813) 259-7691.

About Eeyore

Canadian artist and counter-jihad and freedom of speech activist as well as devout Schrödinger's catholic

55 Replies to “Imam charged with sexual battery on teen boy at Tampa mosque”

  1. “Former mosque board member Yusuf Strohmier said “If he did it — which is a key there, because you have to have witnesses”

    Thank God (The real Judeo-Christian one and not Allah) that this case is not being investigated under Shari’ah standards, where 4 witnesses excluding the victim are required for proving sexual assault. It’s highly unlikely that the 4 other people holding the victim down would testify as witness and the perpetrator would certainly walk. We are going to have to settle with using the backward infidel standard of proof which includes a victim statement, medical and forensic evidence to build a case.

  2. “Alaa Attia, a trustee of the mosque, said that if the accusation is true, it would go against the teachings of Islam.”

    Humm, maybe not the koran, but this is certainly in keeping with the examples of mohammed himself – and that’s the same thing. Part of islam.

  3. I believe that either convicted or proven innocent, it still an individual loathsome and unbelievable crime, same thing if a catholic priest is accused of such a crime, it doesn’t represent the entire church followers. Let’s just hope and pray for the truth to prevail over all. I`m a muslim and really feel sorry to hear something like that happening and going around.

  4. The difference is, in Catholicism, sex with children is an exception and indeed a crime. In Islam, its considered the ideal. Mohammed married a six year old and marriages of old men marrying children sold to them is common and legal. Confusing the exception with the rule is a common trick of the relativists. Still doesn’t make it germane.

  5. “If he did it — which is a key there, because you have to have witnesses — that’s just sick,” he said. “That is a sick thing to do.”

    DNA has often been described as the “silent witness” – and IMHO, trumps four Mohammedans any day.

  6. it is wrong to think that the prophet set the ideal marriage with youngsters. it is one thing to marry somebody to save them from slavery and prostitution
    (which the prophet did) and it is another to make it ideal. and even so, don’t forget that in certain states the legal marriage age is set to 13 years-old …
    I think this is just another propaganda, they went over terrorism and killing innocents, oppression of their women, now they have to figure something out with the kids.
    Seriously guys!

    “Missouri: A person under age 18 cannot marry without the consent of the custodial parent or guardian. DzA person under age 15 cannot marry without approval of a judge in the county where the marriage license is sought.”

    “New Hampshire: A female between the age of 13 and 17 years and a male between the age of 14 and 17 years can be married only with the permission of their parent (guardian)”

  7. Cameon Brothers and sisters of Islam dont be fooled, we cant be fooled by anyone Becauz Allah is always with us, Actually is A LIE LIE LIE LIE LIE This Imam is innocent he did not rape any boy, Because they think he is Xtreemist BUT NOT. try to follow up.

  8. Dear Friends,
    It certainly is a terrible thing when any cleric of any religion does such horrible things. In Islam, they don’t let these types get away so easily. But, unfortunately, in the USA, they have so much of this happenning among catholics, and the so called “Born Again” losers that, protect they must. So, stiff jail terms and guess what? the rest of society pays for them. Just take a look at that filthy book christians follow. Nobody knows exactically who wrote it. It contains incest, rape, sodomy, riff with how to kill and that includes infants ect..( you are what you read). The majority of what is followed today is from the teaching of Saul of Tarsus, who was a bounty hunter. Lets remember my christian dummies, not until heaven and earth pass shall the least of these laws be changed. Well we are still on the earth, and heaven is still here also. Who would you rather follow, the Master, or some want-a-be self appointed scum. Try to follow what Jesus lived and died for and not what some self appointed bounty hunter says. But then again, you people can interpret what The Craetor says because you all think you are self appointed prophets like your teacher, saul did. Keep believing the lie, hell wants its share also.

  9. THIS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH ISLAM. JUST BECAUSE A MUSLIM DID SUCH A TERRIBLE THING LIKE THAT, THAT DOESNT MEAN ISLAM ALLOW SUCH AN ACTION. I AM A MUSLIM AND IF THAT STORY IS REALLY TRUE HE MUST GET THE MAXIUMUM PENALTY IN ISLAMIC LAW WHICH COULD BE A CAPITAL PUNISHMENT. PLEASE DONT JUDGE ISLAM FROM WHAT PEOPLE DO. IN FACT, READ AND EXPLORE THE TEACHING OF ISLAM AND THEN YOU WILL BE ABLE TO SEE THE BIG PICTURE

  10. Islam absolutely allows that. If you abide by 33:21 then sucking boys’ tongues is ideal, emulable

    behavior:

    Bukhari 1183.

    It is related that Abu Hurayra said, “I never sae al-Hasan without my eyes overflowing

    with tears. That is because the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, went out one day

    and I found him in the mosque. He took my hand and I went along with him. He did not speak to me

    until we reached the market of Banu Qaynuqa’. He walked around it and looked. Then he left and I

    left with him until we reached the mosque. He sat down and wrapped himself in his garment. Then he

    said, ‘Where is the little one? Call the little one to me.’ Hasan came running and jumped into his

    lap. Then he put his hand in his beard. Then the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace,

    opened his mouth and put his tongue in his mouth. Then he said, O Allah, I love him, so love him and

    the one who loves him!'”

    Islamic Homosexuality
    “He who claims that he experiences no desire [when looking at beautiful boys or youth] is a liar,

    and if we could believe him, he would be an animal, not a human being.” – Ibn al-Ghauzi
    “Abu Hanifa, founder of the Hanafite school of Islamic law, for instance, does not prescribe any set

    punishment for same-sex relations (89). According to Abu Hanifa, “If a man enters a woman from the

    odious opening or commits [male anal sex], it is no case of hadd”, or mandatory punishment (Schmitt

    & Sofer 14).”

    “Despite the Prophet’s familiarity with the Talmudic tradition, and his view that sodomy ran

    contrary to God’s will (fasiq), he did not include it among the “abominations” offensive to Allah

    for which he related specific punishments. Nor did subsequent Islamic commentators draw on accounts

    of Sodom and Gomorrah… to condemn homosexuality, as did biblical commentators.” -(Murray and Roscoe,

    Islamic Sexualities, 90).

    “Furthermore, it seems that as well as the acknowledgement by jurists of the adult male desire to

    have sex with male youth, there are also Suras describing the presence of beautiful boy servants in

    Heaven: “And there shall wait on them [the Muslim men] young boys of their own, as fair as virgin

    pearls.” (Qur’an 50:24). If this Sura does not suggest the fulfillment of pederastic desire, it at

    least shows an awareness of male beauty and a desire to be attended by attractive male youth; why

    else make at least two references to immaculate boys in the Holy Book’s description of Heaven?”

    (Shirazi, 2005).

    “In non-juridical texts, one finds countless references to pederasty as practiced on the dhimmi, or

    non-Muslims. The famous Arab poet Abu Nuwas “said that he slept with Christian, Jewish, and

    Zoroastrian boys because he regarded it as ‘the duty of every Muslim to sleep with them’”, and “a

    number of other poets also had a predilection for boys who were not Muslim” (Murray and Roscoe 92).

    “Another writer of the Golden Age, Ibn Falita, encouraged the Muslim male community at large that

    ‘Buggery is good for you, oh Arabs, bugger! Fuck a boy…'” (Schmitt and Sofer, Sexuality and

    Eroticism Among Males in Moslem Societies, 16).

    Indeed, there’s a lot of pederasty in the Islamic, brain-damaged 12-year-olds’ conception of the

    afterlife:

    Koran 52:24: Round about

    them will serve, (devoted) to them, young male servants (handsome) as Pearls well-guarded.

    Also, in Surah 76:19 Allah

    promises fresh youths to Mohammedan men: And round about them shall go youths never altering

    in age; when you see them you will think them to be scattered pearls.

    So even try that ‘it’s a Shia thing; they have a different Koran’ stuff.

    Old-school

    pederasty:

    “Sexual relations in Middle Eastern societies have historically articulated social hierarchies, that

    is, dominant and subordinate social positions: adult men on top; women, boys and slaves below (8).”

    Historically, this state of affairs was not concealed from Western observers who were fascinated,

    shocked, and often attracted by the outward appearances of rampant, barely concealed pederasty. By

    1800, a European traveler to Egypt wrote:

    “The inconceivable inclination which has dishonored the Greeks and Persians of antiquity constitutes

    the delight, or, more properly speaking the infamy of the Egyptians … the contagion has seized the

    poor as well as the rich.”

    The “contagion” in question was spelled out more bluntly by an earlier writer, Thomas Sherley,

    describing the Turks:

    “For their Sodommerye they use it soe publiquely and impudentlye as an honest Christian woulde shame

    to companye his wyffe as they do with their buggeringe boys (9).”

    A 17th century French visitor to the Middle East went so far as to claim that Moslems were bisexual

    by nature, and many male authors gave descriptions of “licentiousness” (lesbianism) among women in

    harems and bath houses. Homosexuality became known to the English as the “Persian” or “Turkish”

    vice.

    This peculiar aspect of the Middle East has never entirely disappeared. The sight of men, even

    soldiers in uniform, strolling along a street hand in hand, strikes first-time visitors as

    extraordinary even today. The Moslem world enjoyed a reputation as a haven for sex with boys and men

    well into the twentieth century. The proclivities of many Western authors like Gustave Flaubert,

    Oscar Wilde, or Andre Gide, reflected the pederast and homosexual attractions of the Islamic

    world…

    The cry for the missing father, that emanates across the Moslem world into the endless void from a

    hundred thousand minarets five times each day, can never be answered. The hatred that motivates Bin

    Laden and his “feminine yet virile” followers is not the normal aggressiveness of the child for the

    father at the Oedipal stage, which can be mediated and managed, but hard-core psychotic

    homosexuality of the son abandoned by his father, a near-incurable condition that can lead to

    homicidal, delusional paranoia.

    This condition is well known to the practitioners of clinical psychology and psychoanalysis in Great

    Britain, where thousands of sons of upper and upper-middle-class families end up in neo-Islamic

    establishments known as Public Schools. It is not too far-fetched to conclude that British

    Islamophilia under Disraeli and after was not merely due to the usual game of balancing the powers:

    “I sometimes wonder if there is not some horrifying attraction, especially for English boys brought

    up in a public school, to the brutal manliness that regards sodomitic rape as an expression of

    virility. In any event, a series of Anglo-Saxon males who have gone in search of their manhood found

    it in Islamic culture: Sir Richard Burton, T.E. Lawrence, and Pasha Club are at the head of a large

    pack, whose rear is brought up by the academic camp-followers and foundation executives who find, in

    their defense of Islam, the excuse for their hatred of Jews (11).”

    Homosexuality is the norm in the

    Siwa, starting with pederasty.

    Anthropologically, homosexuality is normal in Mohammedan societies and

    heterosexual relationships are considered sinful:

    From the book: In traditional Arab society, a man and his wife would never dream of

    walking together in the street, side by side, let alone arm in arm or hand in hand. Such behavior

    would be considered an indecent public display of intimacy whose proper place is at home, in the

    privacy of the bedroom. Even at home in the presence of children, siblings, or parents, the contact

    between husband and wife evinces the same restraint. This is carried so far that it is considered

    utterly bad form for a man to inquire about the well-being of a friend’s wife. The very word for

    “wife” (zawja) in Arabic is felt to be too indelicate to use, because of its sexual connotations (it

    is derived from the verb meaning to couple), and is replaced by various euphemistic expressions or

    circumlocutions, such as imra’ati or maddamti (“my lady”); haram (“woman,” “that which is

    forbidden,” and “that which is sanctified”); umm Hasan (“mother of Hasan,” if Hasan is the name of

    the 1st-born son); bint ‘ammi (“my cousin,” used by the husband even if the wife is not a cousin);

    yakhti (“O, my sister”); or ya bint al-nas (“O, daughter of people”). . . .

    The taboo on homosexuality is not so strong as it was in America in the 1950s . . . and the active

    homosexual role in particular is thought of by the Arab students as compatible with virile

    masculinity. In this respect, the Arab attitude coincides with that of the Turks, among whom the

    performance of the active homosexual act is considered as an assertion of one’s aggressive masculine

    superiority, while the acceptance of the role of the passive homosexual is considered extremely

    degrading and shameful because it casts the man or youth into a submissive, feminine role.

    In most parts of the Arab world, homosexual activity or any indication of homosexual leanings, as

    with all other expressions of sexuality, is never given any publicity. These are private affairs and

    remain in private, especially since homosexual relations are forbidden in the Koran. Popular

    opinion, however, takes no stand against them, and despite the warnings of the Muslim schools of

    jurisprudence, the practice seems to be common to this day. Only in outlying areas, such as the Siwa

    Oasis in the Western Desert of Egypt, has homosexuality come out into the open with the sheikhs and

    the well-to-do men lending their sons to each other. It is interesting that even in a place like

    Siwa where homosexuality is the rule and practiced completely in the open, the passive partner in

    the relationship is derided as a woman.

    Anal rape of children is normal in the Muslim world according to Yoram Schweitzer, who describes:

    …barbarous family and clan dynamics in which children, both boys and girls, are

    routinely orally and anally raped by male relatives; infant males are sometimes sadistically over-

    stimulated by being masturbated; boys between the ages of 7-12 are publicly and traumatically

    circumcised; many girls are clitoridectomized; and women are seen as the source of all shame and

    dishonor and treated accordingly: very, very badly.

    Chesler goes on:

    Shoebat confirmed the widespread sexual abuse of both boys and girls in Palestinian society. “It is

    a strange society. Homosexuality is forbidden but if you’re the penetrator, not the penetrated, it’s

    okay.” He is describing prison sexuality. “If you’re a teenage boy with no hair on your legs other

    boys your age will pinch your butt and tease you. Once, I saw a class of clothed teenage boys

    sexualize their gymnastics exercizes. And once, on a hiking trip, I saw a line of shepherd boys

    waiting for their turn to sodomize a five year old boy. It was unbelievable.”

    Shoebat’s father also told him stories about starving Arab men who would barter sex for meat from

    Iraqi soldiers. According to Shoebat, teenage boys prey upon younger children; older male relatives

    prey upon pre-adolescent and adolescent boys and girls. They do not have intercourse with the girls

    since this would render them un-marriageable and bring shame upon their families. I heard many

    stories in both Afghanistan and Iran about the male preference for anal sex, even within marriage,

    either as a form of birth control or as a preferred homosexual practice.

    Lloyd DeMause reports:

    Physical abuse of children is continuous; as the Pakistani Conference on Child Abuse

    reports:

    “A large number of children face some form of physical abuse, from infanticide and abandonment of

    babies, to beating, shaking, burning, cutting, poisoning, holding under water or giving drugs or

    alcohol, or violent acts like punching, kicking, biting, choking, beating, shooting or stabbings…”

    …Islamist schools regularly practice corporal punishment-particularly the religious schools from

    which terrorist volunteers so often come-chaining up their students for days “in dark rooms with

    little food and hardly any sanitation.” Sexual abuse-described as including “fondling of genitals,

    coercing a child to fondle the abuser’s genitals, masturbation with the child as either participant

    or observer, oral sex, anal or vaginal penetration by penis, finger or any other object and [child]

    prostitution”-is extensive, though impossible to quantify. According to the recent survey of

    Palestinian students, boys report having been used sexually even more often than girls. Children are

    taught strict obedience to all parental commands, stand when their parents enter the room, kiss

    their hands, don’t laugh “excessively,” fear them immensely, and learn that giving in to any of

    their own needs or desires is horribly sinful. All these abusive childrearing practices are very

    much like those that were routinely inflicted upon children in the medieval West…

    Glazov expounds upon the normalcy of deviant sexual

    behavior in Mohammedan societies:

    Socially segregated from women, Arab men succumb to homosexual behavior. But,

    interestingly enough, there is no word for “homosexual” in their culture in the modern Western

    sense. That is because having sex with boys, or with effeminate men, is seen as a social norm. Males

    serve as available substitutes for unavailable women. The male who does the penetrating, meanwhile,

    is not emasculated any more than if he had sex with a wife. The male who is penetrated is

    emasculated. The boy, however, is not, since it is rationalized that he is not yet a man.

    In this culture, males sexually penetrating males becomes a manifestation of male power, conferring

    a status of hyper-masculinity. It is considered to have nothing to do with homosexuality. An

    unmarried man who has sex with boys is simply doing what men do. As the scholar Bruce Dunne has

    demonstrated, sex in Islamic societies is not about mutuality between partners, but about the adult

    male’s achievement of pleasure through violent domination…

    …There is silence around this issue. It is the silence that legitimizes sexual violence against

    women, such as honor crimes and female circumcision. It is also the silence that forces victimized

    Arab boys into invisibility. Even though the society does not see their sexual exploitation as being

    humiliating, the psychological and emotional scars that result from their subordination,

    powerlessness and humiliation is a given. Traumatized by the violation of their dignity and

    manliness, they spend the rest of their lives trying to get it back.

    The problem is that trying to recover from sexual abuse, and to recapture one’s own shattered

    masculinity, is quite an ordeal in a culture where women are hated and love is interpreted as

    hegemonic control.

    With women out of touch – and out of sight — until marriage, males experience pre-marital sex only

    in the confines of being with other males. Their sexual outlet mostly includes victimizing younger

    males – just the way they were victimized.

    DeMause goes on to hypothesize, probably correctly, that all terrorists, like serial killers, are victims of childhood sexual abuse,

    which would explain why 99.9999999% of all terrorists are Mohammedans.

    …The imagery of the terrorists also often betrayed the source of their martyrdom in

    their overwhelming sense of sinfulness: “The moment your first blood spurts out, all of your sins

    are forgiven.” Like serial killers-who are also sexually and physically abused as children-

    terrorists grow up filled with a rage that must be inflicted upon others. Most even preach violence

    against other Muslim nations like Egypt and Saudi Arabia “for not being sufficiently fervent in the

    campaign against materialism and Western values.” A fantasy analysis of their choice of words

    reveals constant use of terms of sexual attack that advocates a defiant rape of others in order to

    restage their own sexual abuse: “It’s time to penetrate America and Israel and hit them where it

    hurts most” and “Americans must be attacked for desecrating our holy places.” Their excitement about

    the “spectacular explosions” inflicted upon others is also sexual in origin; as a psychiatrist who

    interviewed many terrorists reported:

    “We have to study their fantasies to understand these men. The sexual importance is sometimes

    striking. For some, when a bomb goes off, it is like an orgasm. One fellow told me he felt

    ‘liberated’ every time he heard a bomb explode. Some others told me they would place a bomb, then

    sit out on a balcony and listen. When the ‘boom’ came, it was a great relief.”

    The orgasmic explosions outside themselves are necessary, according to those who interviewed them,

    because they “externalize their feelings of inadequacy” that are the result of severe child abuse,

    joining terrorist groups “to provide a sense of identity” and “share their feelings of deprivation

    [and] a sense of imminent danger.”

    Men can have sex with animals, other men, and boys, and women can even have sex with severed body

    parts (from a Saudi site):

    Our companions have said that if the penile head has penetrated A WOMAN’S ANUS, or A

    MAN’S ANUS, or AN ANIMAL’S VAGINA or ITS ANUS then it is necessary to wash whether the one being

    penetrated is alive OR DEAD, YOUNG OR OLD, whether it was done intentionally or absentmindedly,

    whether it was done willfully or forcefully. This also applies if the woman places the male member

    inside her while the man is asleep, whether the penis is erect or not, whether the penis is

    circumcised or uncircumcised. All these situations require that the person committing the act and

    the one the act is committed on must wash themselves, unless the person committing the act or the

    person the act is committed on is a young male or female. In that case it cannot be said that

    the person must wash, for they do not have the responsibility, rather it is said that this person is

    in a state of impurity. If that person can discern (the sexual act) then his guardian can command

    him to wash just as he commands him to perform the ablution washing for prayers. For if he prays

    without washing, his prayer has not been performed correctly; likewise if he doesn’t wash after he

    reaches puberty he must be forced to wash. If he washed as a youth and then reaches puberty, then he

    does not have to repeat the washing.

    Our companions have said that intercourse occurs when a healthy male’s penile head completely

    penetrates (an orifice), as has been unanimously agreed. Thus, when the penile head has completely

    disappeared (inside the orifice), then all the regulations concerning washing apply. It is

    unanimously agreed that it is not necessary that the entire penile shaft penetrate to apply the

    regulations of washing. If part of the penile head penetrates, then the regulations of washing are

    not imposed as is agreed, except by an odd few of our companions who said that even in this case all

    the regulations of washing apply. However, this opinion is wrong, rejected and abandoned. If the

    male member was severed and what remained was less than the length of the penile head, then none of

    the washing regulations apply. If the part remaining was equal in length to the penile head length

    then that part must completely penetrate for the regulation of washing to apply. If the part

    remaining was greater in length to the penile head length then there are two famous opinions for our

    companions. The most correct is that if the portion that penetrates is equal to the length of the

    penile head, then the regulations for washing apply. The other opinion is that none of the

    regulations for washing apply until the entire remaining length of the penile shaft completely

    penetrates and Allah knows best.

    If a man wraps a sheath around his male member and then ejaculates inside a woman’s vagina, then

    there are three opinions from our companions. The most famous is that the man must wash. The second

    is that he does not have to wash because he ejaculated inside the sheath. The third is that if the

    sheath is thick and prevents climax and wetness (in the vagina) then washing is not necessary,

    otherwise it is necessary and Allah knows best.

    If a woman inserts (in her vagina) AN ANIMAL’S PENIS she must wash, and if she inserts A DETACHED

    PENIS (thakaran maktu-an, lit. “a severed male member”; a marital aid perhaps!?) there are two

    opinions; the most correct is that she must wash.”

    The Companions of the Child MOlester

    often engaged in homosexuality and pederasty, with Allah’s blessing:

    But the Qur’an does not prohibit using, as passive sex partners, the ancient category of

    men who by nature lacked desire for women, since such men were not considered “male” as a result of

    their lack of arousal for women. This kind of man is often known as “gay” in modern times, but in

    the ancient world he was identified as an anatomically whole “natural eunuch.” Although the Qur’an

    never uses the word eunuch [khasiyy], the hadith and the books of the legal scholars do.

    Furthermore, the Qur’an recognizes that some men are “without the defining skill of males” (24:31:

    “ghair oolaa il-irbati min ar-rijaali”) and so, as domestic servants, are allowed to see women

    naked. This is a reference to natural eunuchs, i.e. gay men.

    A person had to be indifferent to women’s bodies in order to assume the role as a servant in women’s

    private space. In one case, a servant who had been assumed to be indifferent to women due to his

    being an “effeminate” [mukhannath] was evicted by the Prophet because he unexpectedly demonstrated a

    lascivious attitude toward a woman:

    Bukhari, Authentic Traditions, Book of Marriage, Chapter 114 (162) What is forbidden

    concerning the entering upon the wife by those imitating women. [It was narrated] of Umm Salama that

    the Prophet, peace be upon him, was at her house, and in the house there was an effeminate

    [mukhannath], and the effeminate said to the brother of Umm Salama, Abdullah bin Abi Umayya: If God

    makes you all conquer Ta’if tomorrow, I suggest to you the daughter of Ghailan, for surely she

    approaches with four and turns her back with eight [?]. Then the Prophet, peace be upon him, said:

    This one shall not enter upon you (pl.).

    Muslim, Collection of Authentic Traditions, Book of Greetings, Chapter 912 (note: as translated into

    English by ‘Abdul Hamid Siddiqi, who misleadingly uses the word eunuch as the translation for

    mukhannath. It is precisely because he was not a eunuch that he got into trouble!):

    (5415) Umm Salama reported that she had a eunuch [mukhannath] (as a slave) in her house. Allah’s

    Messenger (may peace be upon him) was once in the house that he (the eunuch) said to the brother of

    Umm Salama: ‘Abdullah b. Abu Umayya, if Allah grants you victory in Ta’if on the next day, I will

    show you the daughter of Ghailan, for she has four folds (upon her body) on the front side of her

    stomach and eight folds on the back. Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) heard this and he

    said: Such (people) should not visit you.

    (5416) ‘A’isha reported that a eunuch [mukhannath] used to come to the wives of Allah’s Apostle (may

    peace be upon him) and they did not find anything objectionable in his visit, considering him to be

    a male without any sexual desire [fakaanoo ya’doonahu min ghair oolaa il-irbah]. Allah’s Apostle

    (may peace be upon him) one day came as he was sitting with some of his wives and he was busy in

    describing the bodily characteristics of a lady and saying: As she comes in front four folds appear

    on her front side and as she turns her back eight folds apear on the back side. Thereupon Allah’s

    Apostle (may peace be upon him) said: I see that he knows these things; do not, therefore, allow him

    to enter. She (‘A’isha) said: Then they began to observe veil from him.

    Note that in ‘A’isha’s telling of the story, she states that the women allowed him into their

    private rooms because they assumed he “lacked the defining skill” (the translator added the word

    male and put “considering him to be a male without any sexual desire,” but the Arabic says only that

    they “deemed him to lack the defining skill”). ‘A’isha actually quotes the Qur’anic verse about men

    who “lack the defining skill of males,” demonstrating that his presence in the women’s space would

    have been proper according to the Qur’an if only he had in fact “lacked the defining skill.”

    However, the statement of the effeminate man about the daughter of Ghailan, whatever it meant,

    indicated to Muhammad that he did not lack the defining skill of males and that, on the contrary, he

    had an appreciation of women as sexual objects. This disqualifies him as an intimate domestic

    servant according to the Qur’an as well as the standards of the day. In a system that depends on

    household servants to be heterosexually indifferent, the main risk is that this indifference can be

    faked. In other words, a heterosexual male can pretend to be an exclusive homosexual in order to

    gain free access to the private space of women…

    …The Qur’an recognizes that there are some people who are “ineffectual” [‘aqeem], thus neither

    male nor female:

    42:49 “To Allah belongs the dominion over the heavens and the earth. It creates what It wills. It

    prepares for whom It wills females, and It prepares for whom It wills males. 50 Or It marries

    together the males and the females, and It makes those whom It wills to be ineffectual. Indeed It is

    the Knowing, the Powerful.”…

    …But the Qur’an and hadith also have traces of the permitted homosexual desires of straight men.

    There is even a hadith in Bukhari, admittedly giving not the Prophet’s opinion but that of Abu

    Jafar, according to which a pedophile is prohibited from marrying the mother of his boy-beloved if

    there is penetration:

    (Bukhari LXII, 25) As for whom(ever) plays with a boy: if he caused him to enter him, then he shall

    not marry his mother.

    (This rule is accompanied in the same chapter by prohibitions against a man marrying both a mother

    and her daughter.) Apparently according to this hadith, even sexual penetration of a boy is not

    considered sodomy, because if it was, surely the sodomite would have more worries than whether he

    could marry the boy’s mother! Like whether he preferred to die by fire, stoning, or falling from a

    high tower! These are some of the punishments mentioned in the hadith for “doing as the people of

    Lut did.” [A reader wrote in to say that this hadith would not necessarily imply that penetration of

    boys was not sodomy, but could be a recognition of the fact that not all crimes will be discovered

    and punished and that one who does penetrate a boy, even if he is not punished for sodomy for

    whatever reason, should at least know in his own conscience that the mother of his boyfriend is off

    limits. In any case, one possible inference from this hadith is still very interesting: namely, that

    if a man plays with a boy without penetration, then marrying the mother is still a possibility!!]

    The distinction between pederasty (sex with boys) and sodomy (penetration of “males”) was commonly,

    albeit not universally maintained throughout the ancient world, and indeed survived throughout most

    of the history of Islam until at least the nineteenth century (in spite of the futile objections of

    some medieval scholars). Apparently, boy-love was considered okay by many people because, like

    “natural eunuchs,” underage boys also lacked the “defining skill of males” (sexual potency with

    women). The Qur’an itself gives support to pederasts in its glimpses of paradise:

    52:17-29 And they shall have boys [ghilmaan] circulating among them as if they were

    hidden pearls.

    56:22-23 and dark-eyed ones [hoorun ‘eenun], the like of hidden pearls

    76:19 And immortal boys [wildaanun mukhalladoona] will circulate among them, when you see them you

    will count them as scattered pearls.

    2:25 And they shall have immaculate partners [azwaajun mutahharatun] in [the gardens] …

    4:57 And they shall have immaculate partners [azwaajun mutahharatun] in them …

    One of the great male Sufi contemporaries of Rabi’a al-‘Adawiyya provided a divine justification for

    a pederastic relationship, which was repeated without a hint of disapproval in a 10th century book

    about great Sufi women:

    One day Rabi’a saw Rabah [al-Qaysi] kissing a young boy [“huwa yuqabbil sabiyyan”]. ‘Do

    you love him?’ she asked. ‘Yes,’ he said. To which she replied, ‘I did not imagine that there was

    room in your heart to love anything other than God, the Glorious and Mighty!’ Rabah was overcome at

    this and fainted. When he awoke, he said, ‘On the contrary, this is a mercy that God Most High has

    put into the hearts of his slaves.’
    (Quoted from as-Sulami, Early Sufi Women = Dhikr an-niswa al-muta ‘abbidat as sufiyyat, translated

    by Rkia E. Cornell, Louisville, KY: Fons Vitae, 1999, pp. 78-79.)

    Besides boys, straight Muslim men were occasionally interested in grown adults as well, provided

    they were not “male.” There is a hadith in which the Prophet’s companions asked whether they were

    allowed to use men (presumably prisoners of war) as “eunuchs” to fulfill their sexual urges, since

    they were far from their wives.

    Bukhari LXII 6:9 [Narrated by ibn Mas’ud:] “We used to fight [in battle] together with the Prophet,

    peace be upon him. There were no women with us. We said: O Messenger, may we treat some as eunuchs

    [a laa nastakhsii]? He forbade us to do so.”

    The version in Bukhari LXII 8:13 says that rather than let the companions “treat [some] as eunuchs”

    in the absence of their wives, the Prophet “allowed them to marry corrupted women” [rakhasa lana an

    nankih al-maraa bil-shaub] from the vicinity, and he recited to them from the Qur’an: “O ye who

    believe! Make not unlawful the good things which Allah has made lawful for you, but commit no

    transgression.”

    The fact that Muhammad forbade the companions from designating men as eunuchs is not the point here.

    Of course, using a straight male as a eunuch was wrong — that was essentially the sin of the people

    of Lut. But what about using a eunuch (i.e. one who permanently lacks arousal with women) as a

    eunuch? Given that ibn Mas’ud made reference to the use of eunuchs for sexual gratification, and

    given that the Prophet understood what he meant, that indicates that the use of eunuchs for sexual

    gratification was known in Arabic society, and was considered a use that was appropriate to eunuchs.

    Since eunuchs were not considered male, there was no prohibition against it, not even in the Qur’an.

    Eunuchs were still sex objects for straight men in the Mamluk dynasty, according to David Ayalon in

    Eunuchs, Caliphs, and Sultans: A Study in Power Relationships (Jerusalem, 1999). They not only

    served to prevent older Mamluks from having sexual access to younger trainees:

    The eunuchs seem to have served as a shield against homosexual lust in yet another way.

    They themselves formed the target of that lust, thus diverting it from the youngsters. They are

    described as being womanly and docile in bed at night and manly and warlike by day in a campaign and

    in similar circumstances (hum nisaa’ li-mutmainn muqeem wa rijaal in kaanat al-asfaar; li-annahum

    bin-nahaar fawaaris wa bil-lail ‘araa’is). [Arabic quoted by Ayalon from Abu Mansur al-Tha’alibi,

    Al-Latâ’if wal-Zarâ’if, Cairo 1324/1906-7, p. 79, lines 1-7; and the same quote from Tha’alibi in

    his Tamthîl wal-Muhâdara, Cairo 1381/1961, p. 224.]

    As for the issue of whether Muhammad himself expressly acknowledged that some people by nature

    refrain from heterosexuality, thus being natural eunuchs, consider the following hadith. It is

    related that one of the Prophet’s companions, Abu Huraira, went to the Prophet, saying that he was a

    “young male” who “feared torment for his soul,” but that he “did not find the wherewithal to marry a

    woman” [innee rajulun shaabbun wa ana akhaafu ‘alaa nafsee al-‘anata wa laa ajidu ma atazawwaju bihi

    an-nisaa’a]. The Prophet remained silent, even after Abu Huraira repeated his statement three times.

    Finally after the fourth time, Muhammad said: “O Abu Huraira, the pen is dry regarding what is

    befitting for you. So be a eunuch for that reason or leave it alone.” [ya Abaa Hurairata, jaffa al-

    qalam bimaa anta laaq fa’akhtasi ‘alaa dhalika au dhar] (Bukhari, LXII 8). (For comparison, consider

    that when Uthman came to Muhammad asking if he could be permitted to live a life of abstinence, he

    was rebuffed.)

    If Muhammad’s answer to Abu Huraira is to make sense, then of course it must bear a relation to the

    statement Abu Huraira made. First we have to ask what kind of torment Abu Huraira feared for his

    soul [nafs]? Muhammad Muhsin Khan, the translator of Bukhari into English, interpreted it as fear of

    committing illicit sexual intercourse. If that interpretation is correct, then we still have to

    determine what “illicit sexual intercourse” would mean for Abu Huraira. As a self-described “male,”

    two forms of sexual activity would be inadmissible and therefore the temptation to them would cause

    torment for his soul: the desire to be sexually passive with a man (known as ubnah) or the desire to

    commit adultery with a female. Yet, Abu Huraira [“the father of kittens”] seemed to hint at a

    solution to his dilemma when he said he did not find (in himself?) what was required for marrying a

    woman. Now, if that merely meant that he had no money to support a wife, for instance, and was

    tempted to commit adultery with a female, then the Prophet would surely have advised him to fast and

    be patient in accordance with Sura 24:33 (also Bukhari LXII 2 and 3), instead of advising him, as he

    did, to accept his fate and, if appropriate, be a eunuch, something which he denied as an option to

    Uthman. On the other hand, if Abu Huraira’s statement meant he lacked potency with women, then

    obviously he could not be fearing the temptation to adultery with women. In that case, only passive

    homosexuality was a danger. However, if he would not ever marry a woman, due to impotency with women

    or for any other reason, then he would not be acting as a male, but rather as a eunuch, in which

    case passive homosexuality would not be forbidden for him. But Muhammad cautions him that his

    identity, either as a eunuch or as a male, has already been determined by his Creator (“the pen is

    dried”), and he must figure it out which it is and live his life accordingly. If he ever intends to

    have sex with a woman (i.e. act as a male), then he must avoid passive homosexuality and get

    married.

    You can also get smuggly with your

    adopted son and your daughter while naked and rape your dead aunt if your retarded 6-year-old niece

    is unavailable because she’s busy with her dolls, because Mo did all of the above.

    Shoot, if you’re in al-Qaeda you can even bake little boys, but then again, we know it’s not about child welfare so

    much as what people think of insecure little Muzzies, is it?

  11. It is a shame when people, who will go to hell anyway for following Saul of Tarsus, have to search in the Hadith and Sunnah, including the Quran and then lie and take out of context what they read. Especially the Morally bankrupt Christians and “Born again” RODANTS. They go around the world spreading their filthy lies, when they should really stay at home and fix the the country they come from where a woman is raped every 3 minutes, and that is what they call their freedom and culture. Incredible when they, especially those tv evangelist vermon, are challenged to a debate on live tv, see how they run. The only thing they offer the world are the wispers of the devil, who Saul of Tarsus listened to while destructing the teaching that Jesus lived and dies for.
    jdamn, first answer the questions about your own filthy book called the bible, and dont worry about what the Holy Quran , Sunna and Hadith say.
    Why does your filthy book tell stories that include incest, rape, and all explanations on how to kill a person. Why?
    Why would the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth need to include subjects that we could find in any porn book in any sex shop?
    Why would Christians believe in human sacrifice, when that was a pagan ritual which was prohibited in all the scriptures?
    Why would we have needed to wait for Jesus to arrive on the scene and be killed for the forgiveness of everyones sins?, why not just do it at the point where Adam and Eve sinneed?
    Why would someone else have to pay for the sins of another, when in all the scriptures it states differently?
    Why would Jesus have to wait untill he was dead to teach what he “really meant” to Saul of Tarsus?
    When Jesus met with his desciples for the last time he said that he was going to the Father, he didnt say that he was going to Saul of Tarsus first and then to the Father, I dont think a Prophet of GOD ALMIGHTY would lie, why?
    Answer these questions first my dear friend, and dont worry about others, it is your morally bankrupted people and religion who you should worry about!

  12. Reading Marvin here is like taking a quote from the example page of Schizophrenia biweekly. I would like to answer him but his stuff is so whacked out there is no start point. Probably because no one bothers to respond to what is so clearly drooling insanity he feels he wins victories. Trust me Marvin, say that crap to the wrong guy and you may find yourself biting down on some serious voltage in a hospital gown. Maybe someone who knows the bible can take your stuff on. I already showed you Koranic stuff which is horror show and being utilized today all over the world to commit atrocities. But facts arent interesting to you. Just slander you can make up about books and gods and Djinn and demons.

  13. Marvin. Can you tell me as an example, what was the pivotal moment in “Sauls” life? Why do you use the name Saul in the first place? You talk about filthy lies, yet give no examples. I fyou are going to make the charge, you really should proivide evidence. Muhammed was a child molester and murderous thug. That is not a filthy lie, it is simply historical fact. Perhaps you can respond in kind and tell me exactly what filthy lies youa re referring too. Since my Catholic faith is grounded in truth, I would want to kow about these terrible “Filthy lies” so that I may break free of anything that would not be honest and noble. Can you say the same? Are you willing to abondon a faith or code of conduct that has at it’s heart, perversion of children, enslaving or killing those who choose to reject your faith, or treat your women as animals to be handed about in arranged mairrages with no consideration for how they feel aobut it? Surely if you see Christianity as nothing but “Filthy lies” you yourself would never belong to anything as reprehensible as what I have described, right? After all, truth clearly means everything to you. So I await your reply. Provide me with evidence of these lies that cannot be refuted, and I will deonoucne my Catholisim and join you in your muslim faith. But at the same time, I expect you to show me how the Koran is wrong, how the Hadith does not contain the edicts pointed out , that muslim clerics do not preach destruction and death to infidels in the name of Allah. Since you care so much for the truth, I expect nothing less. Time will tell if my expectationsn will be satisfied. Don’t keep me waiting.

  14. Jdamn………..one word for you…..”Psycho”…….Get some help…..you sound extremely hateful fanatic. Islam does NOT allow what this Imam (Priest) did. Its punishable by death…….Stop pointing fingers at other religions…..do what you believe is right…..but be sure to take your medications. God bless.

  15. To Eeyore,
    First of all my dear tough guy, YOU are the lucky one, SINCE, I am well versed in the Bible. YOU are not. In fact YOU are not interested in FACTS. What YOU have stated about the Holy Quran is out of context and also not what the Holy Quran says, but what YOU like to think it says. Fortunately in Islam only prophets recieve revelation from GOD ALMIGHTY, not every Tom, Dick & Harry so as to interpret as we like as the followers of SAUL do. Here are some of examples of the filth that the Bible is full of;
    1) INCEST:
    Genesis 19:33-35 (New International Version)

    33 That night they got their father to drink wine, and the older daughter went in and lay with him. He was not aware of it when she lay down or when she got up.

    34 The next day the older daughter said to the younger, “Last night I lay with my father. Let’s get him to drink wine again tonight, and you go in and lie with him so we can preserve our family line through our father.” 35 So they got their father to drink wine that night also, and the younger daughter went and lay with him. Again he was not aware of it when she lay down or when she got up.
    2) INCEST B/T MOTHER & SON:
    Genesis 35:22 (King James Version)

    22And it came to pass, when Israel dwelt in that land, that Reuben went and lay with Bilhah his father’s concubine: and Israel heard it. Now the sons of Jacob were twelve:

    3) INCEST B/T FATHER IN LAW & DAUGHTER IN LAW:
    Genesis 38:15-18 (King James Version)

    15When Judah saw her, he thought her to be an harlot; because she had covered her face.

    16And he turned unto her by the way, and said, Go to, I pray thee, let me come in unto thee; (for he knew not that she was his daughter in law.) And she said, what wilt thou give me, that thou mayest come in unto me?

    17And he said, I will send thee a kid from the flock. And she said, Wilt thou give me a pledge, till thou send it?

    18And he said, what pledge shall I give thee? And she said, Thy signet, and thy bracelets, and thy staff that is in thine hand. And he gave it her, and came in unto her, and she conceived by him.
    ( By the way, out of this disgusting story of incestuous sex between a father-in-law and daughter-in-law, twins were born, who were to become the great-grandfathers of Jesus Christ. For proof look to the book of Mathew 1:3)

    4) INCEST & RAPE B/T BROTHER & SISTER:
    “…he took hold of her (Thamer, his sister, not to be confused with Thamer in the previous example), and said unto her, Come lie with me( or better explained, have sex with me), my sister.
    “and she answered him, Nay, my brother(Ammon, one of the sons of David, the man after God’s own heart), do not force me…
    “But he would not listen to her; and since he was stronger than she was, he overpowered her and RAPED her (his sister)

    5) WHOLSALE RAPE & INCEST BETWEEN SON & HIS MOTHERS:
    2 Samuel 16:22 (King James Version)

    22So they spread Absalom a tent upon the top of the house; and Absalom went in unto his father’s concubines in the sight of all Israel.

    FOR MORE EXAMPLES OF FILTHY INCEST & OF DIFFERENT TYPES SEE LEVITICUS: 18:18, 20:11-14 AND 17-21.
    I have many other examples of the filth that may be found in this book. But, only if YOU would like to further your educational lessons.
    By the way, I have often debated the so called people of the “good book”, they all run away. First know YOUR religion and book before you ceremoniously pontificate about another’s.
    BY THE WAY, you are what YOU eat, and YOU also are what YOU read. Your so called holy book needs to be kept away from children and sold in between Playboy and Penthouse.

  16. Dear Nick,
    Since YOU don’t accept The Holy Quran or Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) why DON’T you FIRST answer what I told Eeyore and what may be easily found in the Bible. Don’t get me wrong, I have no need to attack Christians’, but it seems to be a fact that Christians go on the attack of not only Islam but every other religion out there with that Holier than thou attitude. By the way, to your credit, I personally find Catholics to be a friendly bunch of people who are usually attacked by the born again haters. With that said here are some findings about Saul;

    1) The Book of Mathew 24:5
    “For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many”

    2) The Book of Mathew 24:11

    “and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people”

    Therefore deceiving is the main attribute

    But how will this False Prophet Deceive?

    Jesus (pbuh) Explains:

    Mathew 7:15

    “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves”

    Therefore;

    A. He will disguise & pretend what he is not.
    B. He will be greedy, perhaps for material gains.
    C. He will do anything to convert people.

    Does this match Paul (Saul of Tarsus)?
    Mathew 7:15 Matches what Paul has to say 100%

    I Corinthians 9:

    20: When I am with the Jews, I live like a Jew to win Jews. They are ruled by the Law of Moses, and I am not. But, I live by the law to win them.

    21: And when I am not with people who are ruled by the law, I forget about the law to win them. Of Course, I never really forget about the law of God. In fact, I am ruled by the law of Christ.

    22: When I am with people whose faith is weak, I live as they do to win them. I do everything I can to win everyone I possibly can.

    But, why would Paul be so desperate to deceive?

    I Corinthians 9:

    7: Do soldiers pay their own salaries? Don’t people who raise grapes eat some of what they grow?

    11: When we told the message to you, it was like planting spiritual seed. So, we have the right to accept material things as our harvest from you. In the same way, the Lord wants everyone who preaches the good news to make a living from preaching this message.

    So, Paul was deceiving for Money and “Material things” because, he wanted “to make a living out of preaching”

    Jesus (pbuh) explains another way that a false prophet will deceive:

    Mathew 24:24:
    For false Christs, and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect – if that were possible.

    This is exactically what Paul did!

    He even boastfully claimed to be equal to Jesus (pbuh), because he performed great signs and miracles!

    II Corinthians 12:

    11: …for I am not in the least inferior to the “Super – apostles, even though I am nothing.

    12: The things that mark an apostle – signs, wonders and miracles – were done among you with great perseverance.
    ISSA pbuh) Warned:

    Mathew 5:19:
    Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven…

    Who broke the Laws and taught others to do so:
    …………….PAUL (Saul of Tarsus) and he teaches;

    Romans 10:4
    Christ is the end of the Law, so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.

    Galatians 2:16

    Know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith….not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified.

    Jesus (pbuu) Warned:

    Mathew 24:

    23: “At that time someone may say to you, ‘Look! Here is the Christ!’ Or, ‘There he is!’ Do not believe it.

    26: “So if anyone tells you, ‘He is far out in the desert,’ do not go out there. Or if anyone says, ‘He is deep inside the house,’ do not believe it.

    Who is the famous person in the bible who claimed to have seen Jesus (pbuh) in the desert after the ascension?

    : PAUL

    Acts 9:

    3: And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven.

    4: And falling to the ground he heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting me?”

    The whole region surrounding Damascus was a desert, so unless Paul was inside Damascus, he was in a desert.

    Jesus (pbuh) warned: DO NOT BELIEVE HIM,

    BUT YOU CHRISTIANS NEVER LISTENED.

    What about the “inner room” ?

    Who is the famous person who claimed to have communicated with Jesus (pbuh) while he was I the “inner room”?

    PAUL

    Paul was in Rome for two years as a prisoner, in his cell, the “inner room” he was inspired by Jesus (pbuh) to write:

    1) Ephesians 2) Colossians

    3) Philippians 4) Philemon

    .

    5) Hebrews

    Now we will see what ISSA (pbuh) has to say about the characteristics of the “chidren of the devil”.

    John 8:

    44: You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks in his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

    Not only did Paul lie and deceive, but he was “a murderer from the beginning”

    Paul states in his own testimony:

    Acts 22:

    4: I persecuted the followers of this way to their death, arresting both men and women and throwing them into prison.

    PAUL WAS A BOUNTY HUNTER

    ISSA (pbuh) warned that someone will destroy the religion from within, and you will not even know it!!

    Mathew 13:

    25: But, while everyone was sleeping; his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away.

    For years Christians have been sleeping!!

    PAUL ( SAUL OF TARSUS) IS A

    FALSE PROPHET

    Christian Sources

    Holy Bible, New International Version – UK

    Holy Bible, English Standard Version

    Holy Bible, New King James Version

  17. To The Girl on The Right,
    No, what YOU mean is when MUSLIMS do it, it is Islam. When unfortunate things happen, I don’t think it is useful to blame the religion. When a black male in America commits a crime, they say “an afro-america or black male” when a person of hispanic origen commits a crime it becomes ” a hispanic youth” when a white commits a crime it is called ” a youth of so and so age” I don’t ever remeber when it is reported as a catholic youth, or a protestant youth or a methodist youth or a born again youth. But WHY, WHY when the person is a muslim the crime is reported as a muslim youth? Why don’t they call it for the race like alll the other times and blame it on the religion? I don’t blame religions, there are enough lunatics in every culture to be blaming religion. It is unfortunate, but since I am a Muslim, I dislike it as much as you do as a christian. But, I don’t tolerate double standards. By the way, I accepted Islam and born and raised in these United States. So, I know what I am talking about. By the way, if any person wants to enquire about another religion they would do justice to themselves by reading a book written by the people of that religion. I never quote what a muslim, of jew, or hindu has to say about christianity. I go to the source.

  18. WHY WE SHOULDN’T EAT SWINE HOG, PIG

    ( Pork – Ham – Bacon – Pepperoni )

    According to the Holy Quran, The Torah the pig is considered unclean.

    The Main Reasons:

    1) The pig will eat anything; waste, garbage, including its own dead child.
    2) A pig will eat other sick and infected animals, they are scavengers.
    3) The pig also has one of the poorest digestive systems of any animal. It takes only 4 hours and that is not good.
    4) Because the digestive system is so quick and so poor many times the toxins (a poisonous produced by living cells or organisms) from the food are not properly eliminated and are then stored in the pigs fat.
    5) That means that the pig can eat all kinds of filth and garbage, it can eat other infection, then only 4 hours later it sits at the butcher waiting to be slaughtered. Then in a few days it is on your plate at home. You are having ribs, but the problem is that those toxins were never eliminated properly from the pig.

    What does GOD say its ok to eat:

    Cow – lamb – dear – buffalo. These animals eat fresh, clean vegetation. Their digestive system is much more sophisticated. In fact, a cow has 3 stomachs and that fresh and clean vegetation that it eats is processed through a digestive system that takes 24 hours.

    • Think about it 24 hrs. vs. 4 hrs.

    – Would you rather eat an animal that eats fresh clean vegetation or an animal that eats waste and filth?
    – An animal that poorly processes the food and stores all the toxins in its fat or an animal that properly eliminates the toxins from its body?

    Jesus lived and preached His whole life never eating pork. He considered it not clean. Why then do Christians eat it in defiance of there Prophet? The reason most will say is because Saul, said all is clean unto you. Problem, Saul never met Jesus, Sual never knew Jesus, and why would Jesus, a Prophet of GOD ALMIGHTY have to wait until he was lifted up to tell Saul what he really meant? Makes no sense, want to follow a bounty hunter or the Master?

  19. I concur with you, Marvin. When Timothy McVeigh blew up the Federal building in Oaklahoma City, no one said it was a Christian Terrorist……America needs to be educated to tolerate others……they have no clue…..they are all as I call it “Media Minds”…..no knowledge whatsoever. As a muslim, I love Jesus and Moses just as much as Christians and Jews do if not MORE . So please stop this non-sense and follow what Moses and Jesus taught us……tolerance, patience and love. Stop looking for things in other religions and twist them in a way to make the religion look horrible. None of the religions teach that. I believe each and every religion is to make human beings more civilized…..and unfortuantely I don’t see that here. Peace for ALL.

  20. PharmD when McViegh blew up his building he did not yell “praise Jesus” nor did he make a video claiming he was acting in the name of Christ. When terrorists from Islam do their terrorist thing they leave no doubt whatsoever this is about Allah and Islam. It is not just reasonable to connect Islam and Islamic terrorism its stupid and suicidal not to.

  21. Eeyore
    Just stick to answering my questions and don’t worry what others are doing; your religion has done enough damage around the world. How did the Indians do with those loving Christians when they met them so long ago? I will tell YOU, those turn the other cheek fun loving Christians killed almost every one of them!! How do YOU suppose Christianity spread around the globe? What happened in India, South America, North America, China, and Japan? Forcing what Saul of Tarsus said onto populations. Nothing has changed today! YOU are one of those holier than thou, preaching hypocrites who love your wine and your drugs! Have a couple of girlfriends, have some children out of wed lock and then complain when others marry more than one wife and up to four, but at least are responsible for them, and treat them all equally. Not like the hypocritical west with their girlfriends that the state winds up paying for, huh…? I guess when the west go around the world it is not for their man god, they think they are saving the whole world…Isn’t that right..? Stop preaching and get an education first.

  22. Eeyore, no arguments with you since you are an “Eeyore” who has NO CLUE. Closed minded fanatic. Only Christians are RIGHT, the rest will go to hell as far as “Eeyores” like you are concerned. I wonder if you are a part of KKK as well. Supremacists……I hate arrogant religious people…Thats not what religion teaches……

  23. Eeyore,
    He certainly didnt scream “praise Jesus” but when that stinking corpse Bush) was in The White House he did say that his man-god told him to kill millions and some of his good buddies also claimed that ” they new their man-god is better than other gods’. What does this mean, but before you answer enilighten me about what your book has to say….

  24. Pharmd ‘Religion teaches’ every warped thing you can possibly imagine. As you cannot refute the facts I stated you had to resort to calling me a KKK Christian. A sure sign you lost any quantifyable debate. Wouldnt it have been a wonderful thing had you just said “Yes you are right there is a problem with Islam and rape and treatment of non Muslims in the world today” but instead when you ran out of lies you switched to insults. You are a great example of what I am trying to illustrate. I must admit, every time I am shown to be correct about islam, it makes me truly sad. I so want to be wrong about this.

  25. Marvin lies -“Eeyore,
    He certainly didnt scream “praise Jesus” but when that stinking corpse Bush) was in The White House he did say that his man-god told him to kill millions and some of his good buddies also claimed that ” they new their man-god is better than other gods’. What does this mean, but before you answer enilighten me about what your book has to say….”

    Bush never said any such thing. If Bush wanted to kill millions he could have with very little effort. Islamic governments such as Iran and non state actors such as Al Queda and Hizbolah are actively seeking WMD’s in order to kill millions as they do state every week at least. Bush had access to the worlds largest weapons stockpile in history and could have deployed them had he chosen. Instead, he ordered expensive smart weapons be filled with cement instead of explosives in order to take out tanks without killing anyone nearby. Yes thats the facts. Bush spent extra money in Iraq to avoid killing uninvolved people while Muslims in conflict consider all involved and even blow up mosques full of worshiping Muslims if they feel it has any religious or strategic advantage. This in a way is at least consistent as Muslims typically use mosques as arsenals and bomb factories anyway so why would they respect them as houses of peaceful worship? a better question, why should we?
    In any case your lies simply do not stand up to the most cursory examination of facts. Why not just admit what is real and we can all move forward together to build a secular world of freedoms and opportunities?

  26. Eeyore, my apologies. I thought you were just another brainless American picking on Islam just becuase what the media is saying. And yes you are right the way “Some” muslims treat others, but thats NOT ISLAM. ISLAM literally mean peace. Whenever I get a chance, I read the bible as allah asks us to believe in Bible and Torah, but the original versions not the ones people have changed to their benefit.
    What really disappoints me is that when one muslim does something terrible, the entire religion is blamed out of ignorance. I just hope people like you learn some more and be a bit open minded as I am sure Bible and Christianity DOES NOT teach to hate others that are non-christians.

    Again I apologize for losing it. I should have been patient with you as I am supposed to. I am not vey religious, but I do research on other religions because I don’t believe if I was born into Islam, that means we are the ONLY ones going to heaven. In that case, Mother Theresa would go to hell, which my mind does not accept.

    BTW, can you please answer some of the questions Marvin has above.

  27. Eeyore,
    Bush said his god told him, and I am going put it out there so that YOU can change the topic again at hand. So, did many of his cronies in the white house, along with a born again sick whacko military personnel. As far as countries surrounding Israel, why don’t YOU look into DIMONA, and the nuclear arsenal Israel has, you know the old saying “what’s good for the goose is good for the gander” Make Israel get their nukes out first and then it will be a fair game. By the way, if YOU are not a JEW in Israel YOU cannot own a piece of land. That includes Christians Muslims and everyone else. That is an apartheid country. But this is beside the point; YOU need to answer my questions about YOUR holy book. Do I need to bring out some more secrets about that made up religion? I am not sorry for being rude, YOU people talk a lot to say about everything in the world and I am just helping YOU off YOUR high horse. By the way, could YOU tell me why some books of the bible contain 66 and others 70 or more? Which is the word of GOD ALMIGHTY?, not the man-god, I mean the CREATOR of HEAVEN and Earth.

  28. Pharmd Marvin doesn’t really have questions so much as false statements. One example is his nonsense about Israel and rights for non Jews. A true example of an Apartheid state would be Saudi Arabia or indeed ANY Islamic state where sharia law forbids non Muslims from enjoying equal legal status as people. Here is one video about a Palestinian sentenced to death for selling land to a jew in Gaza. http://vladtepesblog.com/?p=7625 this is a much closer approximation to apartheid than Israel. Imagine for a moment if you would, a Jewish man sentanced to death within Israel for selling land to a Palestinian Arab or Muslim. Do you think the world would ever hear the end of it? Yet most do not even know about this incident. It is highly illegal for Muslims to sell land to Jews. That is in fact apartheid. Also, please watch this video by a Muslim Arab living within Israel about what rights he has and does not have as a non Jew. I also ask you to check the following facts for yourself…
    1. Israel has Arab Muslim judges on the supreme court.
    2. Israel has Arab Muslim members of Parliament
    Then tell me what sharia states can say the same about non Muslims on their courts and legislatures. Here is the video of the Arab Muslim in Israel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbrIWyEhl8A

    As for the stuff about Bush it is utter fabrication. I have already given examples of the facts of Bush in Iraq. He has yet to give one reference for his absurd claims.

  29. Eeyore,
    What does not and never did make sense to me that why is there a Jewish state in the middle of all these Muslim countries. Its because British did this in 1948 so the world can NEVER have peace. Took poor Palestinians land like they took it from poor Native Americans and Mexicans. The American ( white man’s way)…grab and snatch. History shows that. So I am NOT surprised if :
    1. Israel has Arab Muslim judges on the supreme court.
    2. Israel has Arab Muslim members of Parliament
    Its all politics to look good in front of the world. I am NOT saying Palestinians are not causing any problems, but what would you do Eeyore if some stranger comes in and takes over your house and land????
    If America is sleeping with Israel, why don’t the US bring them all over here and give them Rhode Island ( they will fit there very easily). So we can get rid of this violence for ever. US did that for all those other countries including Iraq refuges. But US will never do that is because they have their own interest in the region. Be analytical, not bias. God bless us all and may peace rule all over the world. And may God guide us all in the right direction where we all live in harmony. After all, we are all humans first before Muslims, Jews, Christians and others.

  30. Eeyore,
    READ what this NY paper had to say about Bush & and get an education, by the answer my questions about that filthy book.

    NYTimes.com > Magazine
    IN THE MAGAZINE
    Faith, Certainty and the Presidency of George W. Bush
    By RON SUSKIND

    Published: October 17, 2004

    Kevin LaMarque/Reuters
    Candidate Profile: George W. Bush
    Bruce Bartlett, a domestic policy adviser to Ronald Reagan and a treasury official for the first President Bush, told me recently that ”if Bush wins, there will be a civil war in the Republican Party starting on Nov. 3.

    ”Just in the past few months,” Bartlett said, ”I think a light has gone off for people who’ve spent time up close to Bush: that this instinct he’s always talking about is this sort of weird, Messianic idea of what he thinks God has told him to do.” Bartlett, a 53-year-old columnist and self-described libertarian Republican who has lately been a champion for traditional Republicans concerned about Bush’s governance, went on to say: ”This is why George W. Bush is so clear-eyed about Al Qaeda and the Islamic fundamentalist enemy. He believes you have to kill them all. They can’t be persuaded, that they’re extremists, driven by a dark vision. He understands them, because he’s just like them. . . .

    ”This is why he dispenses with people who confront him with inconvenient facts,” Bartlett went on to say. ”He truly believes he’s on a mission from God. Absolute faith like that overwhelms a need for analysis. The whole thing about faith is to believe things for which there is no empirical evidence.” Bartlett paused, then said, ”But you can’t run the world on faith.”

    DID YOU READ THIS EEYORE …..

  31. Eeyore,
    Keep to the topic my Biggoted lamb and answer my questions about YOUR book. Saudi Arabia has nothing to do what we are speaking about. By the way, they live alot better in Saudi Arabia than 99 % of the slaves in the West. Which brings me to another interesting question; Are YOU a Born again, catholic, Jew which one are YOU my little lamb. Are You from Europe,America, or a transplant? Who just spirts out lies and plain bigotry then changes the subject in order to avoid questions. WHAT ABOUT YOUR BOOK AND ITS FILTHY STORIES? By the way, I am from these United States, and I am also have distanced myself from that book YOU so love, thank GOD, AND THERE ARE ALOT OF US AMERICANS LIKE ME, OF EUROPEAN HERITAGE WHO HAVE EMBRACED THE ONE TRUE RELIGION…ISLAM. By the way, I promise YOU, that YOU will live the day to see one of YOUchildren or neice, nephew become one of us. Tough luck YOU dont like it. I love the Founding Fathers of my Country. Freedom of speach and religion. I guess YOU would love to change that my little lamb. But YOU cannot even answer some simple questions in response to lies that YOU speak. Don’t worry, YOU man god will reject YOU also.

  32. Marvin posts a pointless and clearly nonsesical old New York TImes article which if it had any truth in it at all, Bush would have actually acted on it during his 8 years as president of the United States. The facts are, Bush spent a fortune in money blood time and resources to minimize casualties both in terms of enemy fighters, civilians and even infrastructure. Hell the US spent hundreds of billions rebuilding Afghanistan and Iraq. To quote an old NYT opinion piece as meaningful is laughable at best. I have already stated enough verifiable facts in this thread to support my position. The article which Marvin quotes actually proves my side of this debate (such as it is) as Bush did none of the things this author accuses him off when he had the chance. As to PharmD The Jewish state has always been there. Islam didnt appear till milenia after Jews had been building Jerusalem and surrpinding areas. Mohamed conquored the Arabian Peninsula and if you want to say that the area is rightfully theirs by right of conquest thats fine. Then its OK with you if we go and properly conquor the area for secular humanism Judaism or whoever has the weapons and guts to do it. You are asking why Brazil, a Portuguese nation is in the middle of Latin America, a sea of Spanish speaking nations? I guess Brazil has no right to exist then? And Australia Canada and the USA should wipe out all the indians cause after all why are they maintaining small islands of indigenous culture in a massive area of English invaders?
    Once again, There is NO Nation which is Islamic by choice. ALL Muslim nations where made so by force.

  33. Marvin, you don’t get to tell us to answer your questions until you’ve successfully refuted every single point in my above post. If you had any concept of logic – the only means by which one could ever hypothetically win an argument – you wouldn’t be trying your pathetic straw man logical fallacies with Eeyore like a brain-damaged 5 year-old.

    This isn’t about our book and its so-called ‘filthy stories,’ which, as your above post makes crystal clear (while somehow ostensibly trying to prove the opposite) actually doesn’t endorse any of this. Even if it did there’s simply not a pervasive culture in the West or in any Judeo-Christian society in history in which people overwhelmingly rape their own children and the children of others because of some fake ‘divine’ injunction to do so (2:223).

    Oh, and stop talking about Jesus in Islam because there’s not a single reference to Jesus in any Islamic text. Please, after you’ve refuted every single point in my above post using nothing but unitary logic, irrefutable fact, direct quotes, and reputable citation like I did and like people with all their mental faculties do, go ahead a show me where the Koran, Hadith, or Sira makes reference to Jeshua/Yeshua. Your references to Esau the exiled psychopath are irrelevant — everywhere. I’m waiting, nancy. I promise to personally push the post through if it gets caught in the system for having an overabundance of links to reputable sources.

  34. Marvin you cretin I haven’t avoided anything. Who I am has nothing whatsoever to do with the veracity of my arguments. I have posted many points and invited you to look them up. You probably did which is why you are avoiding my arguments. You know all you have is insults and lies. Either what I am saying is true or not and this has nothing to do with whether I am from Andromeda Galaxy or the Milky Way.
    1. Islamic states are truly apartheid states. This is demonstrably true.
    2. Arabs and Muslims have more rights in Israel then they do in most Islamic states. This is also demonstrably true. I cited examples and videos as well as testimony by Arab Muslims in Israel all of which can be easily verified.
    3. The % of people who live well in Saudi Arabia is very small, and are ALL Muslim Males. Women are slaves there and non Muslims are also slaves there. So Saudi Arabia is not a good example of a good place to live, unless you are part of the one half (men) of the 1/3rd of the population which is part of the royal family. The GDP of the KSA, Kuwait and Iran together does not equal that of Spain. Why? Spain may have no oil but Muslim nations have nothing else.
    4. There is no four its just fairly crazy ramblings and rantings of what may be from a lying Muslim immigrant to the US or more likely a prison convert to Islam who thinks that joining a religion of barbarism somehow adds a kind of nobility to a thuggish nature.

  35. Eeyore,
    You obviously are brain-washed my friend. Muslim countries have nothing but oil….I wonder if you have ever read history books. Muslims did not invent cars like Americans, but they contributed astonishingly to everything else from Math to Astronomy. Read a little more with an open mind and you will find out. If you can’t find those history books, I can send you some.
    Have you ever wonder why muslims kill non-muslims??? Not because Allah sasys it…..Allah NEVER said to kill innocents. Allah says to be KIND to fellow humans, not just fellow Muslims. We are supposed to lead by example. Treat your neighbors as if your family. My friend, they do it out of frustration that the West causes for them. West has this arrogance of power and goes around showing off their weapons by killing innocent Muslims. Which in turn creates all these so called “Terrorists”.
    Obama just said “Salam-o-Alaikum” in his speech and every single Muslim was ready to hug him. So the problem is NOT one sided, my friend. Picture has 2 sides to it. Again, think critically, not how you were brain-washed and raised. May God show us all the right path.
    I still love you as a human being and our creator is the same if you believe it or not.
    I am starting to get this feeling that you don’t believe in anything at all, and you HATE Muslims. And I don’t blame you for that because you believe what you see. But again true ISLAM is not what you see these suicide bombers claiming. They are like the red-necks of Muslim world, if you will.
    And stop quoting some isolated incidents from a few Muslim countries. Women have more rights then men in Islam as a Mother, Sister, Wife and a Daughter. You can’t even begin to imagine. All you Americans know is that Muslims can have 4 wives….and the reason you guys point that out is becuase you guys take it in a “Sexual” way….like sleeping around. Islam allowed that in those days to support those widows whose men were killed. Not to have endless sex…..thats your filthy minds. Yours meaning Americans, Not YOU.

  36. Excellent well researched history of Islam and the scientific revolution part I http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/018190.php this is an exceptionally well researched and well written essay. Do read it. It clears up a great deal of misunderstandings about science history and Islam. For example, it was Hindu’s who invented the zero and basic maths. It was Muslims who murdered as many Hindus as they could and took from Europeans Hindu invention when they realized it was useful for weapons. Most arhitecture thought of as ‘Islamic’ was in fact taken from the Byzantines who the Muslims also slaughtered. You can credit the Muslims for the Renaissance though. Turns out that when the Muslims invaded Byzantium and raped the women, captured the male children for proxy armies and attempted genocide on the men, several Byzantine men escaped to Italy bringing the knowledge of their direct ancestors, the ancient Greeks and Romans with them starting the age of reason in Europe. Something Arabs haven’t seen since Mohamed was middle aged.

  37. Jdamn,
    Oh, and stop talking about Jesus in Islam because there’s not a single reference to Jesus in any Islamic text. Please, after you’ve refuted every single point in my above post using nothing but unitary logic, irrefutable fact, direct quotes, and reputable citation like I did and like people with all their mental faculties do, go ahead a show me where the Koran, Hadith, or Sira makes reference to Jeshua/Yeshua.
    Again, one word for you…..”psychotic”. Please take your meds, I don’t mean drugs.
    And if you can read, Jesus is named Issa in Arabic. He is mentioned more than Mohammed is in Koran. Love ya.

  38. Pharmd, absolutely nothing came from the Muslim world that was created by a Muslim. Nothing. Except exploding underwear, and that was using Western and Chinese technology. That’s why the entire Muslim world, oil excluded, has a lower GDP than Corsica or Indiana and all we make is corn and soybeans. Again, straw man attacks don’t prove anything and they’re the last resort of the brain-damaged psychopath. That you immediately go there is quite disturbing. j You have not told the truth once in here, nor have you been able to back up a single lie of yours, nor have you disproven a single point of mine.

    And if Isa is Jesus and you claim to respect him, then why why you refer to him as ‘hairy red bastard?’ Because that’s what Isa/Esau means. The most compelling argument as for Isa meaning Jesus is – and I’m not kidding – that Christians screwed it up 600 years before the advent of Islam. Your claim makes no sense linguistically, historically, or logically.

    So go ahead and refute every single point in my above post and then in this article:

    http://www.answering-islam.org/Responses/Abualrub/true-name-isa.htm

    By the way, I have a Master’s in linguistics.

    Oh, and take your taqiyya elsewhere. We know that non-headbanging, non-child molesters are neither innocent nor human to you people. So go ahead and refute Sura 9 while you’re at it, too, child molester. And stop being a bad Mohammedan. If you’re not actively advocating the rape of one’s brain-damaged 6-year-old family members at every opportunity you’re not living up to 33:21:

    Sahih Muslim Book 008, Number 3459:

    Jabir b. ‘Abdullah (Allah be pleased with them) reported: I married a woman, whereupon Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to me: Have you married? I said: Yes. He said: Is it a virgin or a previously married one (widow or divorced)? I said: With a previously married one, whereupon he said: Where had you been (away) from the amusements of virgins? Shu’ba said: I made a mention of it to ‘Amr b. Dinar and he said: I too heard from Jabir making mention of that (that Allah’s Apostle) said: Why didn’t you marry a girl, so that you might sport with her and she might sport with you?

    Obviously virgin = toddler and sport = rape.

    You have to advocate that at every opportunity. Bad, bad Mohammedan.

  39. jdamn,

    NO, YOU will answer my questions and leave all YOUR cut and paste lies from western scum to another one. I am from YOUR community, and I want YOU to defend YOUR book. YOU answer my questions, I am not going to answer questions which do not hold water. If YOU belong to the true religion, bring me back to Christianity. But, YOU know YOUcan’t, because all YOU do is speak lies like YOUR master Saul admitted to and like all the ” praise the lord waive your hands in the air” born agains, YOU don’t like to answer questions, real questions about YOUR filth.

  40. jdamn,
    Get an education, in the Holy Quran the name of Jesus (PBUH) is mentioned more times than any other Prophet and has nothing to do with what was said. A whole chapter is in the name of his mother, and by the way, did Mary ever wear short shorts..? Show how savvy YOU are with YOUR book, and forget about ISLAM. YOU don’t accept it, I was Christian, debate me on what YOU supposedly are a master at, or are YOU..? The name ISSA is much closer to who YOU call Jesus. He, ISSA, would never have answered to “Jesus”. All your names, Jesus, God are translations from a Semitic religion. There are three; Arabic, Hebrew, and Aramaic. That includes those anglicized made up word and yeshua, all garbage made up words in English like the others, oh, and I wouldn’t dream of forgetting messiah, the translated word anointed from the Greek. By the way, even a pagan king was messiah in YOUR book, including pots and pans. So, YOU are telling me that YOU worship the pots and pans god-man?

    YOU stick to YOUR book with me “Mary” and forget about Islam, I am from YOUR community. YOU debate me on YOUR book. Leave YOUR lies and cut and paste to someone that will give credence to the excrement YOU spurt. Are YOU up to it or are YOU going to admit YOU cannot, that YOU have no knowledge of YOUR own book?

    Since YOU are the master of Christianity, and Eeyor a lackey, YOU enlighten me about what Christianity and its man-god has to offer. Don’t keep ME waiting if YOU are all YOU think YOU are.

  41. jdamn (Mary) scholar,

    Answer MY questions including these. I am interested in Christianity, so between a christian and an ex-christian lets see what YOU are up to. Don’t keep me waiting, and that includes my previous questions:

    Whose idea was it anyway to do away with, abolish, and destroy the Laws of the Prophets?

    Both the God of Abraham (PBUH) and Jesus (PBUH) state in the Torah that the Law is;
    1. “Everlasting”,

    2. “For All Generations”,

    3. “a Perpetual Ordinance”

    The Book of Exodus:
    21 In the Tent of Meeting, outside the curtain that is in front of the Testimony, Aaron and his sons are to keep the lamps burning before the LORD from evening till morning. This is to be a lasting ordinance among the Israelites for the generations to come.
    27:21 (New International Version – UK)

    43 They shall be on Aaron and on his sons when they come into the tabernacle of meeting, or when they come near the altar to minister in the holy place, that they do not incur iniquity and die. It shall be a statute forever to him and his descendants after him.
    28:43 (New King James Version)

    28 In the future, whenever the people of Israel lift up a peace offering, a portion of it must be set aside for Aaron and his descendants. This is their permanent right, and it is a sacred offering from the Israelites to the LORD.
    29:28 (New Living Translation)

    21 When they do, they must wash their hands and feet so that they will not die. For all time to come, that will be a law for Aaron and the priests who are in his family line.”
    30:21 (New International Reader’s Version)

    17 It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested.’ ”
    31:17 (New International Version)

    The Book of Leviticus:
    18′(A)Every male among the sons of Aaron may eat it; it is a permanent ordinance throughout your generations, from the offerings by fire to the LORD (B)Whoever touches them will become consecrated.'”
    6:18 (New American Standard Bible)

    22And the priest among Aaron’s sons who is consecrated and anointed in his stead shall offer it; by a statute forever it shall be entirely burned to the Lord.
    6:22 (Amplified Bible)

    34For the wave breast and the heave shoulder have I taken of the children of Israel from off the sacrifices of their peace offerings, and have given them unto Aaron the priest and unto his sons by a statute for ever from among the children of Israel.
    7:34 (King James Version)

    36Which the LORD commanded to be given them of the children of Israel, in the day that he anointed them, by a statute for ever throughout their generations.
    7:36 (King James Version)

    9Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, or thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations:
    10:9 (King James Version)

    15The heave shoulder and the wave breast shall they bring with the offerings made by fire of the fat, to wave it for a wave offering before the LORD; and it shall be thine, and thy sons’ with thee, by a statute for ever; as the LORD hath commanded.
    10:15 (King James Version)

    7And they shall no more offer their sacrifices unto devils, after whom they have gone a whoring. This shall be a statute for ever unto them throughout their generations.’
    17:7 (21st Century King James Version)

    14And ye shall eat neither bread nor parched corn nor green ears, until the selfsame day that ye have brought an offering unto your God; it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations in all your dwellings.
    23:14 (21st Century King James Version)

    21And ye shall proclaim on the selfsame day that it may be a holy convocation unto you. Ye shall do no servile work therein; it shall be a statute for ever in all your dwellings throughout your generations.
    23:21 (21st Century King James Version)

    41And ye shall celebrate it as a feast to Jehovah seven days in the year: [it is] an everlasting statute throughout your generations; in the seventh month shall ye celebrate it.
    23:41 (Darby Translation)

    3Outside the veil of the testimony, in the tent of meeting, shall Aaron dress it from evening to morning before Jehovah continually: [it is] an everlasting statute throughout your generations.
    24:3 (Darby Translation)

    The Book of Numbers:
    8 The sons of Aaron, the priests, are to sound the trumpets. Your use of these is a permanent statute throughout your generations.
    10:8 (Holman Christian Standard Bible)

    15 The community is to have the same rules for you and for the alien living among you; this is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. You and the alien shall be the same before the LORD:
    15:15 (New International Version)

    8And the Lord said to Aaron, And I, behold, I have given you the charge of My heave offerings [whatever is taken out and kept of the offerings made to Me], all the dedicated and consecrated things of the Israelites; to you have I given them [as your portion] and to your sons as a continual allowance forever by reason of your anointing as priests. (A)
    18:8 (Amplified Bible)

    11And this also is yours: the heave offering of their gift, with all the wave offerings of the Israelites. I have given them to you and to your sons and to your daughters with you as a continual allowance forever; everyone in your house who is [ceremonially] clean may eat of it.
    18:11 (Amplified Bible)

    19 “I give to you and to your sons and daughters all the holy contributions that the Israelites present to the LORD as a perpetual statute. It is a perpetual covenant of salt (A) before the LORD for you as well as your offspring.”
    18:19 (Holman Christian Standard Bible)

    23 The Levites will do the work of the tent of meeting, and they will bear the [consequences] of their sin. The Levites will not receive an inheritance among the Israelites; (A) this is a perpetual statute throughout your generations.
    18:23 (Holman Christian Standard Bible)

    10 The man who gathers up the ashes of the heifer must also wash his clothes, and he too will be unclean till evening. This will be a lasting ordinance both for the Israelites and for the foreigners residing among them.
    19:10 (Today’s New International Version)

    The Book of Deuteronomy:
    29 Oh, that their hearts would be inclined to fear me and keep all my commands always, so that it might go well with them and their children forever!
    5:29 (Today’s New International Version)

    2 Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the LORD your God that I give you.
    4:2 (Today’s New International Version)

    32Obey all the laws and teachings I am giving you. Don’t add any, and don’t take any away.
    12:32 (Contemporary English Version)

    The Book of Psalms :
    160All you say can be trusted;
    your teachings are true
    and will last forever.
    119:160 (Contemporary English Version)

    This is what Jesus (PBUH) had to say about the Law;

    The Fulfillment of the Law:
    17″Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen; will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
    (Matthew 5:17-19 [New International Version])

    17″ But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one stroke of a letter of the Law to fail.
    (Luke 16:17 [New American Standard Bible])

    Jesus (PBUH) also confirms the Laws for all generations and everlasting by FOLLOWING the Laws;

    4 Then Jesus said to him, “See that you don’t tell anyone. But go, show yourself to the priest and offer the gift Moses commanded, as a testimony to them.”
    Matthew 8:4 (Today’s New International Version)

    19 So the disciples did as Jesus had directed them and prepared the Passover.
    Matthew 26:19 (Today’s New International Version)
    10 When his brothers had left for the Feast, he went also. But he went secretly, not openly.
    John 7:10 (New International Reader’s Version)

    Actions speak louder than words and besides the actions of Jesus(PBUH) keeping the Everlasting Laws, Jesus (PBUH) also says;

    Jesus Gives Full Meaning to the Law
    17 “Do not think I have come to get rid of what is written in the Law or in the Prophets. I have not come to do that. Instead, I have come to give full meaning to what is written. 18 What I’m about to tell you is true. Heaven and earth will disappear before the smallest letter disappears from the Law. Not even the smallest stroke of a pen will disappear from the Law until everything is completed.
    Matthew 5:17-18 (New International Reader’s Version)

    Jesus (PBUH) explains how to enter Paradise:
    1) The Rich Young Man
    16Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do to get eternal life?”
    17″Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, obey the commandments.”
    18″Which ones?” the man inquired.
    Jesus replied, ” ‘Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, 19honor your father and mother,'[a] and ‘love your neighbor as yourself.'[b]”
    20″All these I have kept,” the young man said. “What do I still lack?”
    21Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
    22When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth.

    Matthew 19:16-22 (New International Version)

    2) The Rich Young Man
    17As Jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him. “Good teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”
    18″Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone. 19You know the commandments: ‘Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, do not defraud, honor your father and mother.'[a]”
    20″Teacher,” he declared, “all these I have kept since I was a boy.”
    21Jesus looked at him and loved him. “One thing you lack,” he said. “Go, sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
    22At this the man’s face fell. He went away sad, because he had great wealth.

    Mark 10:17-22 (New International Version)

    3) The Rich Ruler
    18A certain ruler asked him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?”
    19″Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone. 20You know the commandments: ‘Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother.'[a]”
    21″All these I have kept since I was a boy,” he said.
    22When Jesus heard this, he said to him, “You still lack one thing. Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
    23When he heard this, he became very sad, because he was a man of great wealth.
    Luke 18:18-23 (New International Version)

    Issa (PBUH) continually points to the “scriptures”, in other words, the Torah, the Mosaic Law.

    What conclusion may we come to according to what is stated in the Torah and what Jesus(PBUH) states in the New Testament?:

    That the God of Abraham in the Bible, the Prophets, and the Messiah all say the Laws are unending. The righteous have one enemy, he who leads people astray.

    Who has lead people astray? Who has abolished the Laws?:

    SAUL OF TARSUS

    Christians are always ready to give the excuse that the Laws were to be followed until the resurrection, after the resurrection, the Laws were done away with.
    It is really interesting that this is no were to be found in the Torah or the Prophets from Abraham to Moses to the Messiah.
    You know who made up all these lies?:

    Guess who is the one speaking of abolishing the Law of all the Prophets?:

    SAUL OF TARSUS

    1.So, Christians have been following the made up religion by Saul of Tarsus v.s. What the God of Abraham (PBUH) and Jesus (PBUH) has to say.
    2.What is really interesting is that Saul of Tarsus was a bounty hunter; he hunted Christians to jail and kills them.
    3.Saul of Tarsus never met Jesus (PBUH) in his lifetime.
    4.Saul of Tarsus basis his made up religion on two supposed visions.
    5.The problem that these visions have is that they contradict each other when Saul explains them.

    I don’t think heaven and earth have passed yet oh scholar of scholars. YOU know what is really a joy for me to know, Islam is surpassing YOUR lies, and more American Patriots like me are going to be more numerous than ” Ya ALL” TOUGH LUCK MARY. we are here and not going anywhere. By the way, It will soon become treason to support another country with the money that YOU people give and support some countries with when right here at home poor children go hungry. Charity starts at home, “Ya ALL’ are going to learn the hard way. Meanwhile answer this ex-christians answeres if YOU are so knowledgeable. Please, don’t insult YOUSELF cut and paste.

  42. Marvin (Naim Abdul), you know that I’m 100% unarguably right, which is why you have thus far failed to refute a single point I’ve made. You haven’t even tried, presumably because you know that it’s a futile endeavor. You have to do that before you launch into your taqiyya/tu tu quoque/ad hominem insanity, not just because those are my terms, but because that’s what’s universally expected in debate.

    I really only glanced at your last 3 posts, as they were so glaringly absurd that they bore not reading further. My name is not Mary. Not even close. I am not a Christian. I seriously doubt that you are from my ‘community,’ as folks who exhibit your sort of ‘argument skills’ and ‘logic’ don’t matriculate to third grade in my community, yet you’re deluded enough to believe it must be so. My parents would have disowned me if I lived in student housing for pedophiles while attending Northern Virginiastan Community College, at a satellite campus, no less. LOL. And for the love of sweet jellybeans, there is no mention of Jesus (“hairy red bastard” to you) in the Koran or the Torah, you moron.

  43. JDamn,
    I have a doctorate degree. Not to brag, just an fyi. I get impressed by people like Marvin who did their own research and accepted the “right” religion. Not someone who was born into a religion like you and I and believed everyone else is wrong but them.
    Please don’t twist the meanings of these Koran’s suras/hadith’s to your advantage. I get it….you hate ISLAM. No more arguments. YOU WON. God bless you. Please keep me in your prayers so I can find the right path. Thank you.

  44. jdamn,

    I already told YOU Mary, I am not interested in debating anything about Islam. I am here to call YOU on that filthy book and made up religion, so don’t change the subject YOU parasite bigot. YOUR information is ill conceived and not the truth. I know it and YOU know it, and so does everyone else. But, that is beside the point. If YOUR religion is the truth then it should not be hard to refute what I have asked of YOU. But YOU are unable to debate me on Christianity. Why? Because First of all I did not get information, twist it up and lie about it, and also find some non-Christian or other and get their biased and twisted lie who apparently knows nothing of the religion anyway. I went to YOUR book; I didn’t quote my opinion or another’s. It plainly speaks for itself. It is not up for interpretation as YOU and the rest of the “holier than thou group” think, as if YOU can read into it and explain what ALMIGHTY GOD has to say as if each and everyone of YOU is another Prophet of the ALMIGHTY and HE forgot somehow to add the extra explanations. YOU look pretty stupid; I am not here to debate YOU on Islam. I want YOU to defend YOUR filthy x – rated made up religion. Don’t keep me waiting and show me YOU know something of that fairy tale religion YOU follow. I wish I would find one, just one CHRISSY that could defend his religion as good as he can malign the rest of what the earth believes.

  45. I want everyone to also know that the CHRISSIES follow a man who has admitted to be a liar. Just look to one of my previous postings here. Why the CHRISSIES cannot answer. Here is another example of how Saul of Tarsus admits to being CUNNING and using DECEIT;

    “But be it so, I did not burden you; nevertheless, being CRAFTY, I CAUGHT YOU WITH GUILE”
    (2 Corinthians 12: 16)

    This explains why the CHRISSIES lie and use deceit. First of all they offer a made up religion, who drinks the blood and eat the flesh as cannibals, which is prohibited by any prophet including Jesus(PBUH) accept human sacrifice, which is also prohibited by any prophet including Jesus (PBUH). That’s right Jesus goes up and down every day, crucified over and over again.

    They are morally bankrupt and resort to lies and the whispers of the DEVIL. They play it as they go along and have no problem altering the word of the ALMIGHTY of Heaven and Earth and then want the rest of humanity to swallow the lie they love. The so called “Born Again Haters” this group springs from a hateful human being called Martin Luther.
    So, they have a lot of training on how to hate and lie about the rest of the world. Just like the guy who goes around complaining that it smells like excrement wherever he travels, but fails to see that it is his own and he carries it with him wherever he goes in his pocket (that x- rated book).

  46. To any readers wondering why I do not block Marvin’s insane ramblings the answer is because no matter how man scholarly well researched essays I write on the dangers of mass immigration from Islamic nations or fostering the Islamic religion and accommodating it here in the western world, I could never do as good a job of scaring the shit out of my readership as Marvin here does just being himself. I would like to take this opportunity to thank Marvin for being almost too good an illustration of the dangerous and delusional thinking encouraged and propagated by Islam. Please do carry on Marvin. I feel sorry for any intelligent Muslims who may read you, however it isnt my job to apologize to them for you. Rather, I would like to see them explain you to me.

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