16 Replies to “Dennis Prager at Oxford Union on Israel”
Well,was there a debate? If so,who won?
I’m no apologist for Hamas or Arab Governments.My disgust and distaste with Zionist Israel is that it was founded on occupation,displacement and ethnic cleansing.Period.Now,one can say that about many countries,e.g.America,Canada,Australia,N.Z.that were occupied and colonized.My self,I fought in the Rhodesian Army.Yet,the above countries were founded at a time of European colonization,when we might agree that we didn’t know any better.Indeed,those were days when slavery was accepted.In those colonized countries noted above,including mine,Canada,we don’t have any indigenous peoples living as stateless refugees inside or outside our borders.Second or third class citizens,maybe,but citizens none-the-less,all with a homeland and birthright.That cannot be said for the Palestinian People,millions of whom were,still are,de facto victims of displacement and ethnic cleansing.We are talking about the ethics of occupation,displacement,ethnic cleansing and colonization,a special case of colonization maybe,as Jews have occupied the Holy Land since day one,but Colonization by Zionists and the European Diaspora none-the-less.And that was at a time when we,and Jews especially,should have known better,just after WWll,and a genocidal war at that.Furthermore,this occupation,etc. was occurring at the same time as the West recognized the evils of Colonialism,and began the process of neocolonialism.
Really,when we argue the case against Zionism,we are arguing the sins of Colonialism at a time when we should have known better,whether it be 1948 or 2017.
Above correction: neocolonialism should read decolonialism.
CLEAN UP IN AISLE FOUR.
Mr. Grant above is quite the blow hard…
I have watched a number of these Oxford speeches but never hear how they turn out. I understand that the audience votes at the end. Am I wrong?
And BTW, I thought Mr. Prager did a poor job of defending himself, although I agree with his premise.
Arguably the Zionists represent the more dangerous of the two,ie,Israel vs Hamas.
Zionist Israel is the most powerful state in the neighborhood and region.It is the lone Nuclear capable state in the region.It has the support of the west and the full economic and military support of the most powerful and influential nation in the world,America.It has the ability to draw America into a wider conflict,as we witnessed with the Syrians and Russians.
Hamas is more of a danger to itself than to Israel or the west.It is a two-bit player in a wretched neighborhood.
Zionist Israel is hardly an underdog.When technology,education and economy are part of the equation,superior numbers are secondary.That is not to underestimate the power of technology,as was seen in the early advantages Russian technology confired on the Syrian Army,e.g. SAM’s.
No one but a fool could deny the overall level of stability of the Zionists over their neighbors,just as no one but a bigot could deny that this Jewish majority that made this possible was founded on occupation,displacement and ethnic cleansing.In that sense,it shared much with Apartheid South Africa and racial Rhodesia.
Ron Grant likes to make one long statement and try and turn the discussion on that thread to him instead of what was posted. He is a more articulate troll them most but still a troll, My parents generation defeated the Nazi’s and I notice that he waits until almost all of them and their kids are dead before he raises his head to start spreading his Jew Hatred and the anti Western Civilization BS of the modern Fascists. His types always sneak in and gain enough victories to wake up the people who only want peace, once they are awake they kick the Fascists back into their holes for several generations.
Like it or not,there is a significant distinction between Antisemitism and Anti-Zionism.Look both terms up in your favorite dictionary or two.By the way,you may find it odd that many liberal Jews are more Pro-Palestinian and more Anti-Zionist,and not always for religious reasons.That should give you some pause for thought.Interestingly,Palestinians self refer to themselves as “victims of victims”,acknowledging the suffering of Jews over time and place,mainly at the hands of Europeans and Christians.Zionists,most Jews and the Christian Right on the other hand never acknowledge the sins of occupation,etc,committed by the Zionists and European Diaspora against the Palestinians.
You are following the leftist anti Semitic like when you say anti-Zionism is different from antisemitism. This tactic has been around for a long time and has been used by anti-Semites for decades. Plus your other posts show a very strong strain of Jew Hatred.
I stand by my position that Anti-Zionism is distinct from Antisemitism,and that one may hold Anti-Zionist sentiments at the same time as loving Jews.Likely our positions will remain unchanged,and we just have to agree to disagree here,with mutual respect and understanding.
@Ron Grant
“I’m no apologist for Hamas or Arab Governments.”,
it sounds like you are. But I’ll take you at your word, what posts have you made recently criticising Arab Governments, and Islam, for its endemic human rights abuses, appalling human rights record, and rampant corruption?
“My disgust and distaste with Zionist Israel is that it was founded on occupation,displacement and ethnic cleansing. Period.”,
like the Jews who’ve been ethnically cleansed from all over the middle east, by, err, let me think, Arab Governments, and Islam? Where’s your balance, why don’t you mention that? You could at least be even handed in your “distaste”, it almost sounds like some sort of bias.
“Now,one can say that about many countries,e.g.America,Canada,Australia,N.Z.that were occupied and colonized.”,
well a group of backwards hunter gatherers were displaced, what’s your point? Ethopia would be getting pretty crowded by now. Of course you missed out, the occupations of Arab, Muslim countries, guess you’re marching and posting about that somewhere else? Good job that Iraqi didn’t invade Kuwait, you’d be mentioning that, guess Arabs and Islam, the Ottoman Empire never invaded anybody did it, oh no.
“My self,I fought in the Rhodesian Army.”,
shame you didn’t win, the blacks would be better off than they are now.
Yet,the above countries were founded at a time of European colonization,when we might agree that we didn’t know any better.
“Indeed,those were days when slavery was accepted.”, implying white’s enslaved blacks, it was excepted, by blacks enslaving each other, and selling the “brothers” and the arabs are still slaving today, women, blacks, you name it. Guess you’re outrage is posted elsewhere about this: the pernicious nature of black on black, white on white, and arab on arab slavery. It’s almost like you’re only concentrating on one point of view, like you’re promoting the same old tired Marxist type criticism of the west?
“In those colonized countries noted above,including mine,Canada,we don’t have any indigenous peoples living as stateless refugees inside or outside our borders.Second or third class citizens,maybe,but citizens none-the-less,all with a homeland and birthright.”,
there are no Arab Israeli citizens then? I must have dreamed it.
“That cannot be said for the Palestinian People,millions of whom were,still are,de facto victims of displacement and ethnic cleansing.We are talking about the ethics of occupation,displacement,ethnic cleansing and colonization,a special case of colonization maybe,as Jews have occupied the Holy Land since day one,but Colonization by Zionists and the European Diaspora none-the-less.And that was at a time when we,and Jews especially,should have known better,just after WWll,and a genocidal war at that.”,
which the Arabs supported, unsurprisingly. Oh I forgot you don’t have any sympathy with those Arabs either, you just keep forgetting to mention it.
“Furthermore,this occupation,etc. was occurring at the same time as the West recognized the evils of Colonialism,and began the process of neocolonialism.”,
whereupon the colonised countries, slipped back into the poverty and barbarism that existed before white christians brought such concepts as human rights, and progress to these bankrupt peoples.
“Really,when we argue the case against Zionism,we are arguing the sins of Colonialism at a time when we should have known better,whether it be 1948 or 2017.”,
the only civilised country in the whole middle east, the Arabs and Muslims, should look on and take note, that should be emulating the Jews not fighting them. But that’s Arabs and Islam for you, the only race/culture that’s actually proud to fail, and be backwards.
Go figure.
I have little interest in the Arab world other than the Israeli/Palestinian conflict,though I guess the landscape has changed considerably since al Qaeda days and now ISIS.I come by my interest in the Israeli/Palestine debate honestly,given my Mom’s Dad was a Palestinian Christian borne in Bethlehem,Palestine,in the late 19th century,decades before the recreation of Israel.His family emigrated to Cape Breton,Nova Scotia,where he was killed in the coal mines when my Mom was just a girl.I have no more a dog in that fight anymore than if I had gone to Vietnam or during my service in Rhodesia.
“shame you didn’t win, the blacks would be better off than they are now.”
Perhaps.But I witnessed the daily humiliations of Black Rhodesian’s,and having to chose between that and the misery of their lives today is a matter of choosing between two evils.I choose not to go there.No point.It’s done.
“there are no Arab Israeli citizens then? I must have dreamed it.”
There are many millions of Palestinians denied their Homeland and Birthright,living as stateless refugees in permanent “camps”. Unlike Apartheid South Africa and racial Rhodesia the European Jews and Zionists were so effective in their ethnic cleansing to allow them to become a majority where they were a minority.Palestinian Arabs living in Israel comprise about 20% of the population,and remain a thorn in the side of the Zionists.Israelis have a tiger by the tail with their expanding settlements and the occupation of land with large Palestinian populations.They want the land,but with it comes the Arabs.That’s the other side of the coin when you are given an inch and take a mile.Any fair settlement necessitates each People give an arm and a leg.
” poverty and barbarism that existed before white christians brought such concepts as human rights, and progress to these bankrupt peoples.”
Sure,but we need to practice what we preach.Occupiers and colonizers tend to be arrogant for far too long.On the other side of the coin,on independence,the “occupied” tend to throw the baby out with the bath water.Sheer stupidity.I witnessed that in Mugabe’s Zimbabwe.That is the biggest concern in Israel/Palestine if ever there is a conversation about a single,shared state.And who knows?
“the only civilised country in the whole middle east, the Arabs and Muslims, should look on and take note, that should be emulating the Jews not fighting them. But that’s Arabs and Islam for you, the only race/culture that’s actually proud to fail, and be backwards.”
I’m not so arrogant to judge civilizations and nations as to their rise and fall.There are volumes upon volumes on this subject.Ironically,some of the successes of Jews may be attributed to the various displacements and ethnic cleansing they endured at the hands of others,including the Romans.Despite their persecutions in Europe their Diaspora had the advantage of living in the European milleau,which gave them some advantage in their occupation of Palestine.And ironically,their dream,and the Palestinian Arab,(Christian and Muslim),nightmare,was aided by the very genocidal Holocaust that almost eliminated them.
“Go figure.”
Go figure,indeed.Could use that several times a day in conversation for the rest of our lives and never get a satisfactory answer.
.
As for Rhodesia
Thank you blindguard for taking the time to disseminate Ron Grant’s post; and Ron Grant again for comparing oranges and apples as equals. This is the mind state of the fatherless. Drawn therefore, not spiritually to the Father, but now in body: In submission, resentment or sexual awakening. The fake lives of Islam, Socialism and Homoeroticism. Dead from the necks up. Opportunity to seduce, stun and rape. Condoned in their Koran, Communist Manifesto, and Human Rights Charters. Superior Muslims, superior Workers, and Preferential Sexuals. Printed for all to see and forced to obey. “Four legs good, two legs better.” Advancing Intellectualism, the dissociation from empathic emotional intelligence, needing the beating of the sticks of halal-haram, correct-incorrect, and dom-sub death fantasy. Pain, and then indulging with the pleasure of the relief of un-pain. One needs the other to be motivated to exist. Intimidation, violation and shock followed by surrender, submission and inversion. The wounds that will never heal, are nursed and sustained. Childhood traumas, and the loyalty to the very Authorities that did it, who use it, to make the real you; blaming the unbelievers for holding you back to reaching Paradise. To run from the pain rather than facing the truth that will set you free.
Therefore, viewing the culture of Israel, one of the most noble people in the world, as far worse than Mugabe’s Zimbabwe, is what these three all agree upon. As they march proudly together propping each other up and exacting violence upon resistance, dissent and morality.
This is what Ron Grant is doing. It is a seduction. Sodomizing the mind. The unreal, in place of the real. Muslims do it, Communists do it and Ron Grant does it.
Their same hatred of the self, relies on getting one-over the innocent and naive, explaining to them that these things are far too complicated and wearisome to understand. Briefly, they will feel better about themselves. Then they have to go out again to find another conquest to affirm they are right.
To be literally be thrown off buildings and you have won. That society is civilized no more. And will invert. The poison will do its work.
Black is White. War is Peace. Socialism is Fair. Love is Compassion.
A child can see.
A college student said he understood and liked the post, but two things stood out that he could not see.
“The wounds that will never heal, are nursed and sustained.”
I explained that to control people you must weaken them just enough to be able to maintain their usefulness, but still hold power over them. The parasites of religion, government and the creating of sex slaves: all addicted to their new identities.
Refugees too are assisted from “compassion.” In Europe the results are the same. All those with the name “boss” indelebly printed within them will react in this way. For it was their pride that made them impoverished. So ‘compassionate help’ just helped degrade them further. For not only were their souls damaged (strong before the weak, weak before the strong), they now were feminized by the system as well.
Trapped by their new found poverty of low income, and damned in hell. The tax credited poor have never been so worse off than today.
Muhammad offered Muslims their one way out to Heaven – the way of all dhimmis single-mommed – released from halal-haram while dying defeating Socialism – and they will go directly to heaven, as men.
(Yet all grandma ever had to do was forgive – and go straight to heaven).
@perfectchild
Comparing oranges and apples, is exactly what he’s doing, along with the discussion of abstract people in an abstract world. Although he does do it rather well, I must admit. Articulate and intelligent.
To me, if I may stray into analogy, it seems like if Ron Grant lived on a farm in Africa, with a bunch of other guys, and every night a herd of elephants moved in from the jungle and ate a ton of valuable crops, whilst in the barn, every night, there was a single mouse eating a ounce of grain; when the alarm was raised, everyone would grab their elephant guns and run out to save the crops, dear old Ron would grab a mousetrap, and rush to the barn.
Everyone else would be puzzled by this, except Ron, he wouldn’t see the difference.
Unless, he’s secretly arranged to sell the farm, that would make more sense.
A parable of Apples and Oranges would be this:
“One member from the Hindu Community and another member from the Muslim Community complained to a Judge asking him; “Why is Guru Granth Sahib respected more than our Holy Scriptures?”
The Judge replied “I will check and get back to you, but can you please bring your respective Holy Scriptures with you tomorrow?”
Next day, the Judge asked them both; “Have you brought your Holy Scriptures with you?”, to which both Community members replied “Yes”.
The Judge said; “Show me”.
The Hindu removed his Holy Scriptures GEETA from his cloak and put it in front of the Judge. The Muslim removed his Holy Scriptures QURAN from his bag and put it in front of the Judge.
The Judge remained silent……
After a while, both community members asked the Judge; “Why are you silent?”.
The Judge replied; “I have asked a Gursikh to bring his Holy Scriptures GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI, after which I will answer your question”.
A little while later, there was a lot of noise outside. A few people were seen cleaning and brushing the road, in front of an arriving car. When the car stopped, a few people laid a carpet outside the car leading to the court door entrance.
One man came out of the car holding Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, whilst a second came holding an umbrella canopy high over Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, and a third was doing Chour Sahib over Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. A fourth man started leading the way, sprinkling water on the ground.
Whilst this was going on, a few people had already entered the court room and prepared a high throne with Palki Sahib in place.
Then 8 to 10 Sikhs entered the court room reciting; “Satnam Waheguru”, whilst Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji was brought in and placed on the Palki Sahib with utmost respect.
The Judge then looked at both the Hindi and Muslim community members. Without saying a word, they both picked up their Holy Scriptures and left.”
The realization is, that you can’t compare Israel with Islam. Civilization and the Savage. One is life, the other picking over corpses for a comparative life.
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Well,was there a debate? If so,who won?
I’m no apologist for Hamas or Arab Governments.My disgust and distaste with Zionist Israel is that it was founded on occupation,displacement and ethnic cleansing.Period.Now,one can say that about many countries,e.g.America,Canada,Australia,N.Z.that were occupied and colonized.My self,I fought in the Rhodesian Army.Yet,the above countries were founded at a time of European colonization,when we might agree that we didn’t know any better.Indeed,those were days when slavery was accepted.In those colonized countries noted above,including mine,Canada,we don’t have any indigenous peoples living as stateless refugees inside or outside our borders.Second or third class citizens,maybe,but citizens none-the-less,all with a homeland and birthright.That cannot be said for the Palestinian People,millions of whom were,still are,de facto victims of displacement and ethnic cleansing.We are talking about the ethics of occupation,displacement,ethnic cleansing and colonization,a special case of colonization maybe,as Jews have occupied the Holy Land since day one,but Colonization by Zionists and the European Diaspora none-the-less.And that was at a time when we,and Jews especially,should have known better,just after WWll,and a genocidal war at that.Furthermore,this occupation,etc. was occurring at the same time as the West recognized the evils of Colonialism,and began the process of neocolonialism.
Really,when we argue the case against Zionism,we are arguing the sins of Colonialism at a time when we should have known better,whether it be 1948 or 2017.
Above correction: neocolonialism should read decolonialism.
CLEAN UP IN AISLE FOUR.
Mr. Grant above is quite the blow hard…
I have watched a number of these Oxford speeches but never hear how they turn out. I understand that the audience votes at the end. Am I wrong?
And BTW, I thought Mr. Prager did a poor job of defending himself, although I agree with his premise.
Arguably the Zionists represent the more dangerous of the two,ie,Israel vs Hamas.
Zionist Israel is the most powerful state in the neighborhood and region.It is the lone Nuclear capable state in the region.It has the support of the west and the full economic and military support of the most powerful and influential nation in the world,America.It has the ability to draw America into a wider conflict,as we witnessed with the Syrians and Russians.
Hamas is more of a danger to itself than to Israel or the west.It is a two-bit player in a wretched neighborhood.
Zionist Israel is hardly an underdog.When technology,education and economy are part of the equation,superior numbers are secondary.That is not to underestimate the power of technology,as was seen in the early advantages Russian technology confired on the Syrian Army,e.g. SAM’s.
No one but a fool could deny the overall level of stability of the Zionists over their neighbors,just as no one but a bigot could deny that this Jewish majority that made this possible was founded on occupation,displacement and ethnic cleansing.In that sense,it shared much with Apartheid South Africa and racial Rhodesia.
Ron Grant likes to make one long statement and try and turn the discussion on that thread to him instead of what was posted. He is a more articulate troll them most but still a troll, My parents generation defeated the Nazi’s and I notice that he waits until almost all of them and their kids are dead before he raises his head to start spreading his Jew Hatred and the anti Western Civilization BS of the modern Fascists. His types always sneak in and gain enough victories to wake up the people who only want peace, once they are awake they kick the Fascists back into their holes for several generations.
Like it or not,there is a significant distinction between Antisemitism and Anti-Zionism.Look both terms up in your favorite dictionary or two.By the way,you may find it odd that many liberal Jews are more Pro-Palestinian and more Anti-Zionist,and not always for religious reasons.That should give you some pause for thought.Interestingly,Palestinians self refer to themselves as “victims of victims”,acknowledging the suffering of Jews over time and place,mainly at the hands of Europeans and Christians.Zionists,most Jews and the Christian Right on the other hand never acknowledge the sins of occupation,etc,committed by the Zionists and European Diaspora against the Palestinians.
You are following the leftist anti Semitic like when you say anti-Zionism is different from antisemitism. This tactic has been around for a long time and has been used by anti-Semites for decades. Plus your other posts show a very strong strain of Jew Hatred.
I stand by my position that Anti-Zionism is distinct from Antisemitism,and that one may hold Anti-Zionist sentiments at the same time as loving Jews.Likely our positions will remain unchanged,and we just have to agree to disagree here,with mutual respect and understanding.
@Ron Grant
“I’m no apologist for Hamas or Arab Governments.”,
it sounds like you are. But I’ll take you at your word, what posts have you made recently criticising Arab Governments, and Islam, for its endemic human rights abuses, appalling human rights record, and rampant corruption?
“My disgust and distaste with Zionist Israel is that it was founded on occupation,displacement and ethnic cleansing. Period.”,
like the Jews who’ve been ethnically cleansed from all over the middle east, by, err, let me think, Arab Governments, and Islam? Where’s your balance, why don’t you mention that? You could at least be even handed in your “distaste”, it almost sounds like some sort of bias.
“Now,one can say that about many countries,e.g.America,Canada,Australia,N.Z.that were occupied and colonized.”,
well a group of backwards hunter gatherers were displaced, what’s your point? Ethopia would be getting pretty crowded by now. Of course you missed out, the occupations of Arab, Muslim countries, guess you’re marching and posting about that somewhere else? Good job that Iraqi didn’t invade Kuwait, you’d be mentioning that, guess Arabs and Islam, the Ottoman Empire never invaded anybody did it, oh no.
“My self,I fought in the Rhodesian Army.”,
shame you didn’t win, the blacks would be better off than they are now.
Yet,the above countries were founded at a time of European colonization,when we might agree that we didn’t know any better.
“Indeed,those were days when slavery was accepted.”, implying white’s enslaved blacks, it was excepted, by blacks enslaving each other, and selling the “brothers” and the arabs are still slaving today, women, blacks, you name it. Guess you’re outrage is posted elsewhere about this: the pernicious nature of black on black, white on white, and arab on arab slavery. It’s almost like you’re only concentrating on one point of view, like you’re promoting the same old tired Marxist type criticism of the west?
“In those colonized countries noted above,including mine,Canada,we don’t have any indigenous peoples living as stateless refugees inside or outside our borders.Second or third class citizens,maybe,but citizens none-the-less,all with a homeland and birthright.”,
there are no Arab Israeli citizens then? I must have dreamed it.
“That cannot be said for the Palestinian People,millions of whom were,still are,de facto victims of displacement and ethnic cleansing.We are talking about the ethics of occupation,displacement,ethnic cleansing and colonization,a special case of colonization maybe,as Jews have occupied the Holy Land since day one,but Colonization by Zionists and the European Diaspora none-the-less.And that was at a time when we,and Jews especially,should have known better,just after WWll,and a genocidal war at that.”,
which the Arabs supported, unsurprisingly. Oh I forgot you don’t have any sympathy with those Arabs either, you just keep forgetting to mention it.
“Furthermore,this occupation,etc. was occurring at the same time as the West recognized the evils of Colonialism,and began the process of neocolonialism.”,
whereupon the colonised countries, slipped back into the poverty and barbarism that existed before white christians brought such concepts as human rights, and progress to these bankrupt peoples.
“Really,when we argue the case against Zionism,we are arguing the sins of Colonialism at a time when we should have known better,whether it be 1948 or 2017.”,
the only civilised country in the whole middle east, the Arabs and Muslims, should look on and take note, that should be emulating the Jews not fighting them. But that’s Arabs and Islam for you, the only race/culture that’s actually proud to fail, and be backwards.
Go figure.
I have little interest in the Arab world other than the Israeli/Palestinian conflict,though I guess the landscape has changed considerably since al Qaeda days and now ISIS.I come by my interest in the Israeli/Palestine debate honestly,given my Mom’s Dad was a Palestinian Christian borne in Bethlehem,Palestine,in the late 19th century,decades before the recreation of Israel.His family emigrated to Cape Breton,Nova Scotia,where he was killed in the coal mines when my Mom was just a girl.I have no more a dog in that fight anymore than if I had gone to Vietnam or during my service in Rhodesia.
“shame you didn’t win, the blacks would be better off than they are now.”
Perhaps.But I witnessed the daily humiliations of Black Rhodesian’s,and having to chose between that and the misery of their lives today is a matter of choosing between two evils.I choose not to go there.No point.It’s done.
“there are no Arab Israeli citizens then? I must have dreamed it.”
There are many millions of Palestinians denied their Homeland and Birthright,living as stateless refugees in permanent “camps”. Unlike Apartheid South Africa and racial Rhodesia the European Jews and Zionists were so effective in their ethnic cleansing to allow them to become a majority where they were a minority.Palestinian Arabs living in Israel comprise about 20% of the population,and remain a thorn in the side of the Zionists.Israelis have a tiger by the tail with their expanding settlements and the occupation of land with large Palestinian populations.They want the land,but with it comes the Arabs.That’s the other side of the coin when you are given an inch and take a mile.Any fair settlement necessitates each People give an arm and a leg.
” poverty and barbarism that existed before white christians brought such concepts as human rights, and progress to these bankrupt peoples.”
Sure,but we need to practice what we preach.Occupiers and colonizers tend to be arrogant for far too long.On the other side of the coin,on independence,the “occupied” tend to throw the baby out with the bath water.Sheer stupidity.I witnessed that in Mugabe’s Zimbabwe.That is the biggest concern in Israel/Palestine if ever there is a conversation about a single,shared state.And who knows?
“the only civilised country in the whole middle east, the Arabs and Muslims, should look on and take note, that should be emulating the Jews not fighting them. But that’s Arabs and Islam for you, the only race/culture that’s actually proud to fail, and be backwards.”
I’m not so arrogant to judge civilizations and nations as to their rise and fall.There are volumes upon volumes on this subject.Ironically,some of the successes of Jews may be attributed to the various displacements and ethnic cleansing they endured at the hands of others,including the Romans.Despite their persecutions in Europe their Diaspora had the advantage of living in the European milleau,which gave them some advantage in their occupation of Palestine.And ironically,their dream,and the Palestinian Arab,(Christian and Muslim),nightmare,was aided by the very genocidal Holocaust that almost eliminated them.
“Go figure.”
Go figure,indeed.Could use that several times a day in conversation for the rest of our lives and never get a satisfactory answer.
.
As for Rhodesia
Thank you blindguard for taking the time to disseminate Ron Grant’s post; and Ron Grant again for comparing oranges and apples as equals. This is the mind state of the fatherless. Drawn therefore, not spiritually to the Father, but now in body: In submission, resentment or sexual awakening. The fake lives of Islam, Socialism and Homoeroticism. Dead from the necks up. Opportunity to seduce, stun and rape. Condoned in their Koran, Communist Manifesto, and Human Rights Charters. Superior Muslims, superior Workers, and Preferential Sexuals. Printed for all to see and forced to obey. “Four legs good, two legs better.” Advancing Intellectualism, the dissociation from empathic emotional intelligence, needing the beating of the sticks of halal-haram, correct-incorrect, and dom-sub death fantasy. Pain, and then indulging with the pleasure of the relief of un-pain. One needs the other to be motivated to exist. Intimidation, violation and shock followed by surrender, submission and inversion. The wounds that will never heal, are nursed and sustained. Childhood traumas, and the loyalty to the very Authorities that did it, who use it, to make the real you; blaming the unbelievers for holding you back to reaching Paradise. To run from the pain rather than facing the truth that will set you free.
Therefore, viewing the culture of Israel, one of the most noble people in the world, as far worse than Mugabe’s Zimbabwe, is what these three all agree upon. As they march proudly together propping each other up and exacting violence upon resistance, dissent and morality.
This is what Ron Grant is doing. It is a seduction. Sodomizing the mind. The unreal, in place of the real. Muslims do it, Communists do it and Ron Grant does it.
Their same hatred of the self, relies on getting one-over the innocent and naive, explaining to them that these things are far too complicated and wearisome to understand. Briefly, they will feel better about themselves. Then they have to go out again to find another conquest to affirm they are right.
To be literally be thrown off buildings and you have won. That society is civilized no more. And will invert. The poison will do its work.
Black is White. War is Peace. Socialism is Fair. Love is Compassion.
A child can see.
A college student said he understood and liked the post, but two things stood out that he could not see.
“The wounds that will never heal, are nursed and sustained.”
I explained that to control people you must weaken them just enough to be able to maintain their usefulness, but still hold power over them. The parasites of religion, government and the creating of sex slaves: all addicted to their new identities.
“Love is Compassion”.
I gave him the real-life story of a woman who got her son and herself killed and her younger husband seriously maimed:
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/mother-and-son-killed-stourbridge-west-midlands-took-homeless-man-in-tracey-peter-pirece-wilkinson-a7661501.html%3Famp
Refugees too are assisted from “compassion.” In Europe the results are the same. All those with the name “boss” indelebly printed within them will react in this way. For it was their pride that made them impoverished. So ‘compassionate help’ just helped degrade them further. For not only were their souls damaged (strong before the weak, weak before the strong), they now were feminized by the system as well.
Trapped by their new found poverty of low income, and damned in hell. The tax credited poor have never been so worse off than today.
Muhammad offered Muslims their one way out to Heaven – the way of all dhimmis single-mommed – released from halal-haram while dying defeating Socialism – and they will go directly to heaven, as men.
(Yet all grandma ever had to do was forgive – and go straight to heaven).
@perfectchild
Comparing oranges and apples, is exactly what he’s doing, along with the discussion of abstract people in an abstract world. Although he does do it rather well, I must admit. Articulate and intelligent.
To me, if I may stray into analogy, it seems like if Ron Grant lived on a farm in Africa, with a bunch of other guys, and every night a herd of elephants moved in from the jungle and ate a ton of valuable crops, whilst in the barn, every night, there was a single mouse eating a ounce of grain; when the alarm was raised, everyone would grab their elephant guns and run out to save the crops, dear old Ron would grab a mousetrap, and rush to the barn.
Everyone else would be puzzled by this, except Ron, he wouldn’t see the difference.
Unless, he’s secretly arranged to sell the farm, that would make more sense.
A parable of Apples and Oranges would be this:
“One member from the Hindu Community and another member from the Muslim Community complained to a Judge asking him; “Why is Guru Granth Sahib respected more than our Holy Scriptures?”
The Judge replied “I will check and get back to you, but can you please bring your respective Holy Scriptures with you tomorrow?”
Next day, the Judge asked them both; “Have you brought your Holy Scriptures with you?”, to which both Community members replied “Yes”.
The Judge said; “Show me”.
The Hindu removed his Holy Scriptures GEETA from his cloak and put it in front of the Judge. The Muslim removed his Holy Scriptures QURAN from his bag and put it in front of the Judge.
The Judge remained silent……
After a while, both community members asked the Judge; “Why are you silent?”.
The Judge replied; “I have asked a Gursikh to bring his Holy Scriptures GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI, after which I will answer your question”.
A little while later, there was a lot of noise outside. A few people were seen cleaning and brushing the road, in front of an arriving car. When the car stopped, a few people laid a carpet outside the car leading to the court door entrance.
One man came out of the car holding Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, whilst a second came holding an umbrella canopy high over Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, and a third was doing Chour Sahib over Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji. A fourth man started leading the way, sprinkling water on the ground.
Whilst this was going on, a few people had already entered the court room and prepared a high throne with Palki Sahib in place.
Then 8 to 10 Sikhs entered the court room reciting; “Satnam Waheguru”, whilst Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji was brought in and placed on the Palki Sahib with utmost respect.
The Judge then looked at both the Hindi and Muslim community members. Without saying a word, they both picked up their Holy Scriptures and left.”
The realization is, that you can’t compare Israel with Islam. Civilization and the Savage. One is life, the other picking over corpses for a comparative life.